Warrior General Games

Whether you are building a run stuffing NT or a pass rushing 3-gaper, DT's are in the middle of the defensive line for a reason. They have to battle the hogs on the other side of the field play after play. If you are a NT you will usually be battling 2 every play if your build is good enough. If not, then you are letting the RG block a LB every play because you are getting handled by the C.

The first rule of any DT is GET STRENGTH TO THE SOFT CAP AS SOON AS POSSIBLE For those who don't know what the soft cap is, that is when physical attributes start costing more sp. From 48.06 to 49.06 it still only cost 1 sp. From 48.07 to 49.07 it costs 2 sp. You want to get strength to that range as soon as you can.

Once there, you can choose to keep putting more sps into strength at 2 for 1, or you can start working the second most important attribute which is agility. Agility is slighly more important for the pass rushing DT, but it is still very important for both.

The higher your strength and agility, the lower your tackling and stamina have to be.

Now how much speed, vision, confidence, tackling, blocking, and where to put the SAs, that can all be debated. However, the building blocks to any DT should be:
1. Strength
2. Agility

I've actually had good success going agility first, and then strength, especially for DTs (as opposed to NTs). The theory is that in that sort of build, you want just enough strength to avoid being completely abused, and loads of agility to sidestep your blockers to get into the backfield.

A third option, which I haven't been able to fully test yet, is for an NT type to get strength up really high, and then tackling before agility, with the goal being to use power tackling in order to cause a lot of fumbles.

Your mileage may vary; but if you're limited by a specific plan, you'll never be in a position to unlock the game's secrets.

Unfortunately, I have to agree with the OP. There doesn't seem to be much variance on what works at the DT/NT position. Of course, someone may have a highly successful and secret build, but all of the builds that I've seen wind up essentially the same.

Its a shame too...because they are becoming cookie cutter builds.

Maybe with the 3-4 in play, the builds can be a little more varied. Especially if you are a DT set to play on the end positions.

If someone has a successful build that is contrary to popular opinion, I'd be estatic!!!

Originally posted by durakbane
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the OP. There doesn't seem to be much variance on what works at the DT/NT position. Of course, someone may have a highly successful and secret build, but all of the builds that I've seen wind up essentially the same.

Its a shame too...because they are becoming cookie cutter builds.

Maybe with the 3-4 in play, the builds can be a little more varied. Especially if you are a DT set to play on the end positions.

If someone has a successful build that is contrary to popular opinion, I'd be estatic!!!

You really aren't taking into account the fact that many people seem to read the concepts being discussed on this board and then completely fuck up their brand new "uber" build due to what I can only assume is a mild form of mental retardation.

Originally posted by Garidan
I've actually had good success going agility first, and then strength, especially for DTs (as opposed to NTs). The theory is that in that sort of build, you want just enough strength to avoid being completely abused, and loads of agility to sidestep your blockers to get into the backfield.

A third option, which I haven't been able to fully test yet, is for an NT type to get strength up really high, and then tackling before agility, with the goal being to use power tackling in order to cause a lot of fumbles.

Your mileage may vary; but if you're limited by a specific plan, you'll never be in a position to unlock the game's secrets.

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

Originally posted by t-money
Originally posted by Garidan

I've actually had good success going agility first, and then strength, especially for DTs (as opposed to NTs). The theory is that in that sort of build, you want just enough strength to avoid being completely abused, and loads of agility to sidestep your blockers to get into the backfield.

A third option, which I haven't been able to fully test yet, is for an NT type to get strength up really high, and then tackling before agility, with the goal being to use power tackling in order to cause a lot of fumbles.

Your mileage may vary; but if you're limited by a specific plan, you'll never be in a position to unlock the game's secrets.

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

If you're dedicated, play on a D-League team for a full season. You'll get damn near max snaps no matter what due to the high rotation.

If you're building a DT to play DT or NT in a 4-3, STR is still easily the most important skill. Without it you get pushed around by OGs and OCs a lot. AGI is 2nd most important, and if you are REALLY dedicated to making a pass-rush specialist at DT (hybrid 3-4 DE possibly) then AGI can pay off early with stats, but will hurt you more in the long run imo.

The only real question for a DT, I think, is if you want to go STR 2:1, AGI 2:1, STR 3:1 (obv with other points in spots) or STR 3:1, AGI 2:1.

Originally posted by t-money
I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).

Originally posted by Garidan
Originally posted by t-money

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).



that is very interesting

Originally posted by Garidan
Originally posted by t-money

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).



Wow -- that's not the result that I would have expected based on my experience. For my young ones, I've put equip on STAM and then otherwise left it alone. I trained STR until I had enough pts to get to 48 STR and since then I've been training AGI while I cap STR. The energy results have been sufficient in order to allow me to train on normal.

As an aside, it seems to me that the goal is to not train STAM unless absolutely necessary in the begining of a build -- those training $$ are better spent on your primary attributes. For speed based builds, its unavoidable, but for lineman in particular, it seems feasible.

Originally posted by Garidan
Originally posted by t-money

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).



Which was at NT/DT though? Strength will draw the double teams and then the agility guy can break the blocks faster, thus making the energy drain lessen.

Thats the way I see it at least.

Originally posted by Awesomus_Prime
Originally posted by Garidan

Originally posted by t-money


I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).



Which was at NT/DT though? Strength will draw the double teams and then the agility guy can break the blocks faster, thus making the energy drain lessen.

Thats the way I see it at least.

Very true.

Originally posted by Awesomus_Prime
Originally posted by Garidan

Originally posted by t-money


I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

This is actually a debatable point; I created two DTs side by side, one going str, the other going agi. Both purchased stamina equipment, and trained stamina exclusively. At low-mid levels, the agi guy would end up in between 78-82 energy after games, whereas the strength DT was routinely falling below 70 (I think he cycled down to about 49 before his stamina caught up and he slowly got back up).



Which was at NT/DT though? Strength will draw the double teams and then the agility guy can break the blocks faster, thus making the energy drain lessen.

Thats the way I see it at least.

I think they were both at NT.

If it makes a difference, both were created just as the new D-Leagues came out, so it was probably just me and a CPU at NT, as opposed to 3-person rotation that's common on most teams now that everything's so overfilled. I'd expect if I did the same experiment again, both DTs would have reasonable stamina, even without training it. (I've only recently given up on training stamina first for my players.. oof.)

I decided to take a way different approach to developing a DT/NT. I have focused mainly on speed (63), strength (52), and agility (46) on his way to his current level 19. He can hold his own in a straight up double team, if the offense does much pulling and trapping he is much better as he is usually able to beat the one on one block and pick off a back or a tackle, freeing up the LB for the tackle. At this point where he really excels at is special team play, he makes a lot of tackles on the kick off team. Being an old special teams guy, this is way cool for me. Pass rushing is still a bit of a struggle at this point when they max protect, so I will be working more strength into his equation.

Originally posted by boomer82
Originally posted by t-money

Originally posted by Garidan


I've actually had good success going agility first, and then strength, especially for DTs (as opposed to NTs). The theory is that in that sort of build, you want just enough strength to avoid being completely abused, and loads of agility to sidestep your blockers to get into the backfield.

A third option, which I haven't been able to fully test yet, is for an NT type to get strength up really high, and then tackling before agility, with the goal being to use power tackling in order to cause a lot of fumbles.

Your mileage may vary; but if you're limited by a specific plan, you'll never be in a position to unlock the game's secrets.

I like the agility first concept, however, from a practical standpoint, you'll have a stamina issue at the begining of the build. STR first is easier to build up since you can ignore stam for a little bit and still get max xp.

If you're dedicated, play on a D-League team for a full season. You'll get damn near max snaps no matter what due to the high rotation.

If you're building a DT to play DT or NT in a 4-3, STR is still easily the most important skill. Without it you get pushed around by OGs and OCs a lot. AGI is 2nd most important, and if you are REALLY dedicated to making a pass-rush specialist at DT (hybrid 3-4 DE possibly) then AGI can pay off early with stats, but will hurt you more in the long run imo.

The only real question for a DT, I think, is if you want to go STR 2:1, AGI 2:1, STR 3:1 (obv with other points in spots) or STR 3:1, AGI 2:1.


Nope, I say go either strength or agility 5:0. Make sure whichever you want to develop first is at 32 at level 1, then assign the first 15 points there. That way he will be at 49.01 at level 4 and you don't lose any more 1 for 1 pts in that attribute.

Fun fact: With a bit of work, you can soft cap strength at level 2, for DTs.

I think he was actually referring to the 2-cap (48.07) and 3-cap (61.52) when he said 2:1, 3:1.