Does Smooth Operator SA work for a DB assigned to a Zone?
Forum > Goal Line Blitz > Smooth Operator SA - Confirm or Deny
Robbnva
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if we are being technical, I would say probably not as in zone you aren't covering a specific person.
savanna
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Originally posted by Robbnva
if we are being technical, I would say probably not as in zone you aren't covering a specific person.
That's how I read it as well
if we are being technical, I would say probably not as in zone you aren't covering a specific person.
That's how I read it as well
Brewnoe
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My gut says no, but the SA text doesn't specify man only like Shutdown Coverage does for example.
Thinking about how that would have to be implemented, makes me even more skeptical.
Have the penalty apply to everyone in their zone area? Feels a bit overpowered.
Have it just kick on, when the zone defender is covering someone closely, then switch off when they moved to cover another dot coming through their area? That sounds like it would've been a bit of a nightmare for Bort to code?
So Occam's Razor and all, I'm gonna say no. Don't know how you'd ever prove it was working or not, hard to SEE the vision penalty in action.
Thinking about how that would have to be implemented, makes me even more skeptical.
Have the penalty apply to everyone in their zone area? Feels a bit overpowered.
Have it just kick on, when the zone defender is covering someone closely, then switch off when they moved to cover another dot coming through their area? That sounds like it would've been a bit of a nightmare for Bort to code?
So Occam's Razor and all, I'm gonna say no. Don't know how you'd ever prove it was working or not, hard to SEE the vision penalty in action.
Robbnva
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for shut down corner, if your defense is going to have CBs in man mostly, I imagine everyone just maxes out the top tree? What bonus SAs do people get for CB?
RyanCane26
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Originally posted by Robbnva
for shut down corner, if your defense is going to have CBs in man mostly, I imagine everyone just maxes out the top tree? What bonus SAs do people get for CB?
For man coverage most do not invest in the bonus SA but if they do usually a tackling related one.. diving tackle/wrap up tackle, etc.
for shut down corner, if your defense is going to have CBs in man mostly, I imagine everyone just maxes out the top tree? What bonus SAs do people get for CB?
For man coverage most do not invest in the bonus SA but if they do usually a tackling related one.. diving tackle/wrap up tackle, etc.
Whiskeybilt
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this thread will be helpul if I decide to make dots long term next season.
Edited by Whiskeybilt on Jul 29, 2025 08:49:09
Edited by Whiskeybilt on Jul 29, 2025 08:48:41
Originally posted by Brewnoe
My gut says no, but the SA text doesn't specify man only like Shutdown Coverage does for example.
Thinking about how that would have to be implemented, makes me even more skeptical.
Have the penalty apply to everyone in their zone area? Feels a bit overpowered.
Have it just kick on, when the zone defender is covering someone closely, then switch off when they moved to cover another dot coming through their area? That sounds like it would've been a bit of a nightmare for Bort to code?
So Occam's Razor and all, I'm gonna say no. Don't know how you'd ever prove it was working or not, hard to SEE the vision penalty in action.
That's what I'm thinking too. Smooth Operator being the man specialist version of zone's Ball Hawk although BH is fantastic right.
Same time, I wonder if it kicks in when zone defender decides to pick up a receiver in his zone
My gut says no, but the SA text doesn't specify man only like Shutdown Coverage does for example.
Thinking about how that would have to be implemented, makes me even more skeptical.
Have the penalty apply to everyone in their zone area? Feels a bit overpowered.
Have it just kick on, when the zone defender is covering someone closely, then switch off when they moved to cover another dot coming through their area? That sounds like it would've been a bit of a nightmare for Bort to code?
So Occam's Razor and all, I'm gonna say no. Don't know how you'd ever prove it was working or not, hard to SEE the vision penalty in action.
That's what I'm thinking too. Smooth Operator being the man specialist version of zone's Ball Hawk although BH is fantastic right.
Same time, I wonder if it kicks in when zone defender decides to pick up a receiver in his zone
Edited by dusk883 on Jul 29, 2025 09:24:43
Edited by dusk883 on Jul 29, 2025 09:15:16
Robbnva
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Originally posted by Kenshinzen
Ball Hawk is a broken VA. Nothing similar with an SA that not many put points in.
Can you explain why people think it’s broken?
Ball Hawk is a broken VA. Nothing similar with an SA that not many put points in.
Can you explain why people think it’s broken?
Chris B Chicken
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Originally posted by Robbnva
Can you explain why people think it’s broken?
it's a 15% Speed, Agility boost for defenders in zone coverage only. It also boosts Vision 15% for both offense and defense which isn't especially useful for pass catchers unless you specifically build a Vision monster.
So for easy math, if you assume a 105 Speed, 92 Agility, 92 Vision CB for example. That's 120+ Speed, 105+ Agility, Vision. Add in AEQ and you're closing in on 180 Speed minimum. If the AEQ is included in the math before Ballhawk kicks in (which we believe it is) you're closing in on 190 Speed.
It's impossible to build pass catchers to compete with that, which is probably why INTs are out of control when you throw to anyone other than a scat back.
Can you explain why people think it’s broken?
it's a 15% Speed, Agility boost for defenders in zone coverage only. It also boosts Vision 15% for both offense and defense which isn't especially useful for pass catchers unless you specifically build a Vision monster.
So for easy math, if you assume a 105 Speed, 92 Agility, 92 Vision CB for example. That's 120+ Speed, 105+ Agility, Vision. Add in AEQ and you're closing in on 180 Speed minimum. If the AEQ is included in the math before Ballhawk kicks in (which we believe it is) you're closing in on 190 Speed.
It's impossible to build pass catchers to compete with that, which is probably why INTs are out of control when you throw to anyone other than a scat back.
Robbnva
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I haven’t watched pro ball so I don’t know but are CBs running man or zone? I assume safeties are zone
RyanCane26
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Originally posted by Robbnva
Do top level WRs not have 90 vision?
I’d assume not since catching has to be up high.
80s is highest I've seen and that's definitely not common
Originally posted by Robbnva
I haven’t watched pro ball so I don’t know but are CBs running man or zone? I assume safeties are zone
Most were primarily man but many DCs are switching to zone to try and combat OPC and blockers/strength dots on the outside
Do top level WRs not have 90 vision?
I’d assume not since catching has to be up high.
80s is highest I've seen and that's definitely not common
Originally posted by Robbnva
I haven’t watched pro ball so I don’t know but are CBs running man or zone? I assume safeties are zone
Most were primarily man but many DCs are switching to zone to try and combat OPC and blockers/strength dots on the outside
King of Bling
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Wouldn't you rather jack Super Vision if going that deep into the top tree, rather than Smooth Operator? 
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