Warrior General Games

Here's some background on my basic suggestion that lead block/runner interaction will never look/play right with a mostly independent path/waypoint for each. The runner needs to locate and get on the butt of a designated lead blocker ASAP and stay there for a li'l bit. The lead blocker should determine the path(and speed!) for both for at least a few steps.
Along with this is a need to give us some of the knobs Bort is twisting, trying to find a "one size fits all" set of #'s. Blocking logic is the stuff I want to play with. I'd hate to think the current player tactics options are all we'll ever get. I could care less if never saw another concession pricing screen.......


http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4971454&page=2#46126284
Originally posted by aaasahi
Well I ask GLB fix running path choice and lead blocking revamping from S27........
And it's still looks like shit now.

my reply...
The runners "running path choice" should be how soon/close to get on the lead blockers ass and then how much time/distance/threat is needed for the runner to bail and go into basic run mode.
The basic play path should be set by the lead blocker with the runner simply following.
I've got to believe that something very similar to the code used by coverage dots tracking receivers could be used on runners for following blockers.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4971454&page=2#46138070
"You know, if Bort coded the path different, someone else would be upset his HB didn't go they way it does now?"
my reply...
Yer missing a bigger point Doc. Runners should have no path as long as there's a lead block to follow.

Does anyone here understand this will never look or play right with independent paths/waypoints/etc. for blockers and runners? As many times as i've pointed this out no one has ever picked up on it.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4971454&page=2#46153833
Originally posted by Dr. E
LOL, how do you code something to take an action without telling it what action to take? I'm not much of a programer, haven't messed with it since back when my Apple IIe was the bomb, but I know that's about impossible. At least to do with most computers still capable of using the application.

my reply.....
The lead blocker "action" would follow path/waypoint/threat logic much as is now. The runner "action" locks onto the lead blocker for a determined(hopefully new tactics settable) distance/time/threat level/etc.
I've mentioned that the coverage code that enables one dot to track another could be close to what's needed to do this.
I hate thinking that the current player/team tactics options are all we're ever going to get...........
There's so much that could be added for blocking tactics options for lead and general situations.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4971454&page=2#46153845
Guys, this is becoming more of a blocking complaint thread (or even a Suggestion on what Bort should do thread) than a Bugs thread IMHO.
Let's please post any examples that we want looked at, but the OP is definitely NOT A BUG.
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Anyone else want better lead block/runner interaction and/or more player/team tactics options for blockers?

+1

I fleshed out the OP a bit. Y'all gimme some love........

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but blockers have an assignment and they block that assignment. Looking at the replays lead blockers don't seem to have assignments - if they did there would be no hesitation, no playing dizzybat - they'd move to block their assigned target. You'd need all of 2 Vision to find your pre-determined target - or a set of Mr. Magoo glasses.

You'd think the only time they should deviate from that would be in 3 cases:
1) The target is moving away from playside - i.e. you wouldn't chase a guy to block him, you'd find a new target
1) There is a bigger threat of the play being blown up - i.e. the DE beats the T playside like a drum on a sweep
2) The target is neutralized, then move to another target.

-1 defense already cant blitz because its picked up so efficiently and zones are coded horribly vs run pretty much forcing them to sit in their zone until the HB crosses the LoS..

If you just improve blocking even more then defense won't have anyway of stopping the run.

Right now with the blocking code, the defense doesn't have to worry about stopping the run - the offense will do that for them in most cases. I look at WL games and just shake my head - because if we are seeing these things in WL with arguably the best made players coordinated by the best coordinators - just how bad can it really get for the rest of us?

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2146413&pbp_id=4298612
This ROLB should have either been planted for next years crop, or sent into lunar orbit by the pulling G - it's the whole reason he's pulling. At the worst he should have whiffed trying to block that LB.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2146413&pbp_id=4299707
From the same game, here is a FB who should be punching a hole in the FS chest - instead he does absolutely nothing.

To be fair, the blocking in this game was far better than in other WL games I've looked at. Those plays above pale in comparison to some of the stuff I see - like T's and TE's running into their own backfield to block players trailing rushing plays by 5 yards or more - and ignoring guys right in their mug in the direction the run is headed, and G's/FB's stopping to pick up change they dropped from the holes in their pants.

+1

Originally posted by SG✬21
-1 defense already cant blitz because its picked up so efficiently and zones are coded horribly vs run pretty much forcing them to sit in their zone until the HB crosses the LoS..

If you just improve blocking even more then defense won't have anyway of stopping the run.

Phase 2 of my evil plan will be to give the defense back some of the player alignment/blitz options that were taken away several seasons back.
Either we're going to stay at it until it looks and plays more like the real thing or we'll just settle for this canned game much as it is now.

Originally posted by dbreeze
Phase 2 of my evil plan will be to give the defense back some of the player alignment/blitz options that were taken away several seasons back.
Either we're going to stay at it until it looks and plays more like the real thing or we'll just settle for this canned game much as it is now.

I agree, I'd love to see a bit more free reign in player alignment ect.. but we all know OCs will bitch and moan because they like the fact that it takes 10 minutes to gameplan and you will put up an easy 50 points.

Offense has seen enough improvements as is over the past few seasons where defense's have been nerfed pretty well.. This just makes it even worse.

I think we'll all agree that there's much to improve all over the place. I'm living off the outside run bubble too this season. But I don't think knee-jerk nerfing is getting us anywhere.
If defense needs more alignment/read options to bring balance then lets add what's needed. If that really exposes the blocking logic then let's add something like what I have here.
Don't stop until there's just not much in the real game that's not here.
A Google search for "football simulation" turns up some interesting results lately........

What needs to be done on defense that would be more realistic and bring balance SG?

Not offense got too much improvement, it's passing game got too much buff, and you spent your resource on defending passing then running can merely work. And even this, you still don't need to worry about running game because bad running path and shot blocking choice will help your defense.
Not to mention pass block get mote pancake than run block.

Originally posted by dbreeze
I think we'll all agree that there's much to improve all over the place. I'm living off the outside run bubble too this season. But I don't think knee-jerk nerfing is getting us anywhere.
If defense needs more alignment/read options to bring balance then lets add what's needed. If that really exposes the blocking logic then let's add something like what I have here.
Don't stop until there's just not much in the real game that's not here.
A Google search for "football simulation" turns up some interesting results lately........

What needs to be done on defense that would be more realistic and bring balance SG?

Well i personally think that zones need to be re-coded (yes they just did it but its not how zones should work) and players decision making on routes to get the HB.. Plus bring blitzing back somewhat.

If defense can get those suggestions fixed then I'd be pretty happy with defense overall.

between blockers not taking out the threats or the runners not taking a path where the blockers can help, there's some huge problems. pass blocking and OL blocking in general has dramatically improved, but carrier/blocker coordination on most rushing plays and ESPECIALLY kick and punt returns is still terrible. A simple code that says "don't outrun your blockers" might do wonders for the game.

Originally posted by fogie55
between blockers not taking out the threats or the runners not taking a path where the blockers can help, there's some huge problems. pass blocking and OL blocking in general has dramatically improved, but carrier/blocker coordination on most rushing plays and ESPECIALLY kick and punt returns is still terrible. A simple code that says "don't outrun your blockers" might do wonders for the game.

This suggestion should get it done.

I'd also point out that the current separate path solution should probably remain as an option also. With the addition of user adjustable path/waypoint knobs and levers.....