Warrior General Games

and....when does the coverage become affected from too much speed vs agility.

My level 72 vet had 82 speed and 82 agility natural.......and was always one of the top CBs in his league. Nowadays, it seems like 82 is such a low number for speed...just wondering what people are pumping out these days.

140+

It's gonna be 150/100 as the norm, I think, in a few seasons.

Right now 140/90 does it.

My guy is 121.25 (+36)/96.25 (+16). I also have 7 Change Direction.

I'm not sure uber fast is as important as high Vision these days.

Originally posted by Billy Corman
My guy is 121.25 (+36)/96.25 (+16). I also have 7 Change Direction.

I'm not sure uber fast is as important as high Vision these days.

80-82 or so isn't high enough? Because with the 4 major ALGs on a CB you can easily get 95 speed, 90 agility and 80+ vision with plenty to spare for secondaries and SA.


Edit: And quality CBs these days are at 140/90/80 anyway, or close enough to it.

Mine is 82 natural Vision, +3 with AEQ. Add 15 in Football Genius, that puts me at 90+ total. I also run with 11 Super Vision.

It doesn't matter how fast your dot is if its faked.

Originally posted by Forbin
80-82 or so isn't high enough? Because with the 4 major ALGs on a CB you can easily get 95 speed, 90 agility and 80+ vision with plenty to spare for secondaries and SA.


Edit: And quality CBs these days are at 140/90/80 anyway, or close enough to it.

I disagree with this. Any CB who is sitting at 140/90/80 in the current sim will be seriously lacking in AEQ or secondaries/SAs. In the future, you'll see around 140-145/90/85 as the norm, which should be plenty to deal speed WRs. The separation will be those CBs who are also built well enough to deal with break tackle WRs and possession WRs. Hitting 140+/90/85 along with 75+ jumping, 2 PD % pieces, an MT% piece, and 8+ in SB and SDC will be necessary to deal with all of those. Being able to hit 60 tackling would be great too, but that will be really hard to pull off.

You gotta realize the difference though. 4 majors for CBs vs. 5 majors for WRs is a huge advantage.

CBs have the ability to be just as fast as 150 speed WRs, AND have better secondaries and more SA.

Originally posted by Forbin
You gotta realize the difference though. 4 majors for CBs vs. 5 majors for WRs is a huge advantage.

CBs have the ability to be just as fast as 150 speed WRs, AND have better secondaries and more SA.

Not if they have as many or more abilities they need to invest in. WRs can choose a path--speed, break tackle, or catching--that they can pump high, and CBs have to be able to defend all three. Also, CBs don't have to be as fast to keep up with WRs. The difference in 1 point in speed isn't so much that CBs need to have the same speed to keep up with a WR. In the history of GLB, a CB has always been able to keep up with a WR with 15-25 more speed. We can assume the fastest WR we will likely see who will also have high enough secondaries to be a threat will have 100 base speed, 58 speed from EQ, 4.5 speed from Track Star, and 5 speed from streaky on good days. That means that WR will be running with 168ish speed on good days. So a CB with 145 speed will be on the low end of that range. But, that CB still has to deal with tackle breaking and possession WRs. So while a CB might want to push speed a bit higher to aim for 150 speed, he will have to sacrifice in those areas. Instead, most builders might want to push a little more towards the middle, aiming for a little less speed, but higher PD and tackle scores, and letting their DC adjust the coverage to allow them to cover the speediest of WRs. For a well planned team, having one super-speedster WR might be a good idea, but for the general user building a CB, that probably isn't the best idea.

Here's what I have for an approximate future CB:

Coverage CB (Lv. 74 CB)
Ht/Wt: 6'3", 170lbs

Attributes
Physical Attributes
Strength: 50
Speed: 145.01 (+51)
Agility: 90.02 (+7)
Jumping: 74.02
Stamina: 60.71
Vision: 85.03
Confidence: 48.71

Football Skills
Blocking: 8
Catching: 21.71
Tackling: 60.71
Throwing: 8
Carrying: 8
Kicking: 8
Punting: 8

Special Abilities
Shutdown Corner Abilities
Swat Ball: 8
Sticky Hands: 6
Superior Vision: 10
Smooth Operator: 3
Shutdown Coverage: 10

Speedster Abilities
First Step: 3
Change Direction: 6
Return Specialist: 0
Blitz: 0
Closing Speed: 0

Additional Abilities
Zone Focus: 0

Veteran Abilities:
Ball Hawk: 15
Football Genius: 15
Third Down Stopper: 15
DvG: 15
HJ: 5
OTK: 1

PD Chance +36.5%
MT Chance +25%

Longhorn, I agree things will change in the future. And I agree, as I built my guy this way, that 15 or 20 points behind in Speed is fine. I really believe anything less than 90 Agility is death [Change Direction on top of that, too]. I also think anything less than 90 Vision [with Super Vision enhancement] is death, too. And that's just in today's SIM.

These things will be magnified as WR's develop.

Originally posted by Billy Corman
Longhorn, I agree things will change in the future. And I agree, as I built my guy this way, that 15 or 20 points behind in Speed is fine. I really believe anything less than 90 Agility is death [Change Direction on top of that, too]. I also think anything less than 90 Vision [with Super Vision enhancement] is death, too. And that's just in today's SIM.

These things will be magnified as WR's develop.

I have yet to see any reason to take vision super high, honestly. I've had secondary dots with low vision, high vision, and I even had one with 100 vision and 18 in SV. Still got pump faked all over the place, didn't really make good reads compared to other dots etc. Vision is the most overrated attribute in GLB, imo.

Originally posted by Forbin
I have yet to see any reason to take vision super high, honestly. I've had secondary dots with low vision, high vision, and I even had one with 100 vision and 18 in SV. Still got pump faked all over the place, didn't really make good reads compared to other dots etc. Vision is the most overrated attribute in GLB, imo.

I disagree. I always see improvement in D play with higher levels of vision. I would say that 68 is the lowest possible vision to have for LBs and secondary.

Didnt want to go super extreme but wanted to see how high I could get speed with decent secondary skills. So its going to be easy to get well over 150 speed. I should have went a cap or two lower on Jumping and rounded out Strength and Conf. instead. (Before everyone says 'GTFO that wouldnt work' I wouldnt build my CB like this).


Player Build
Position: cb_man_specialist
Season: 12
Day: 2
Level: 74
Attributes:
strength : 36
speed : 155.01 (+58)
agility : 90.03
jumping : 81.02
stamina : 50.71
vision : 83.02
confidence : 37.71
blocking : 8
throwing : 8
catching : 21.71
carrying : 8
tackling : 52.71
kicking : 8
punting : 8

Top SA Tree: | 6 | 3 | 5 | 2 | 8 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 3 | 11 | 0 | 0 | 0 |

Veteran Abilities:
Ball Hawk: 15
Football Genius: 15
Third Down Stopper: 15
DvG: 15
HJ: 4
OTK: 1

PD Chance +36.5%

Originally posted by tedtinker
I disagree. I always see improvement in D play with higher levels of vision. I would say that 68 is the lowest possible vision to have for LBs and secondary.

I agree, but then I started this aspect of the discussion.

I don't watch nearly all my CB's plays anymore. However, the one's I do watch are completions against him. I rarely see him give up a reception due to a fake, much less the whole enchilada because he was put down with the QB's sniper rifle.

I'm not saying 90 natural. 82 natural with a +3 from a piece of AEQ and Football Genius does it. And Super Vision is still the best SA to help with Fake This crap.