Warrior General Games

I bumped the official lower cost pee wee suggestion thread..

since we're all back and logging in, we need to keep that thread alive.

At this point, I would love for Bort and Staff to acknowledge the thread and agree they will discuss it sometime this season. . similar (to a much lesser extent) of how they reworked morale..

my question .. should we continue adding suggestions? Or just +1 the thead to death with "+1 for change" posts. ??

Send a PM to Catch with all that stuff in it mccollums...his inbox is now officially open.

Originally posted by sigepmagicmike
Send a PM to Catch with all that stuff in it mccollums...his inbox is now officially open.

Yeah well, him and bort have ignored us. Nice to see catch22 posting that he is open for suggestions, doubt he would qualify this as a suggestion even though it makes sense for the consumer and producer.

Posted in that thread:

I think the main thing preventing action is that there is no business case for GLB to make this change.

There are vague comments, like "people are leaving PeeWee" or "more people will join if it costs less" but it is very difficult to back any of this up. If people are leaving, how do you know it is do to the high cost? People leave the game all the time for many different reasons.

The math is simple:
Offer 20% reduction in price, they need to get 25% more teams/players to make the same revenue. Where are these new players coming from? Existing people that never played PeeWee will all of a sudden be interested because it is cheaper? New players to the game?

Or if you look at it the other way, if 10% of people quit PeeWee because of the high prices, but would stay for lower prices, they can offer a 10% discount and still make the same money. And most of the suggestions here are for more than a 10% discount.


It is all extremely difficult to quantify, but if anyone can put together a solid business case outlining how making the changes will make GLB more money, there is no reason they wouldn't do it..

Part of this analysis would be to look at how many PeeWee players there were over the last few seasons versus this season. How many of them have CE and boost? With that info there would be a baseline for how much money is spent on PeeWee every season for the last few seasons, which would be a start.

Obviously that is a huge amount of effort, and the history might not even be possible by anyone other than Bort.

Here is a suggestion to collect the data for this season:
Start a thread in PeeWee. PM every PeeWee owner with the goal for this info and ask them to tally the totals for their own team and post it. I can help coordinate the data and we go from there.

I think the fact that you're overlooking involves the heavily committed owners/agents now. Several of us have a ton of players and would like to build more, own a team (again), etc., but we just won't do it because of the heavy cost of flex.

I'll use myself as an example. I have owned a team in the past that was only mean to be a semi-competitive/experimental team. It was a lot of fun, but I gave it up because I had flex cost in it for ownership, scrims, and dots. Add to that my number of dots on DSBM and other squads like Crib, Wam, SBWL for a while, etc., and I have bunch of dots with CE and boost. The cost got out of hand, so I gave a lot of it up. As a result, I started keeping some dots around. The cost is much less (only boost if I want) to keep them growing. Couple that with some of the idiotic SIM's/changes for PW, and I currently like the older dots better.

Basically, when this flex runs out, I'm done with PW. If I buy anymore flex, it would only be for advancing my older dots. If CE didn't cost so much and/or we got a bit more return on the investment, I'd continue to build more PW dots and would probably end up owning a team and contributing a lot more. I'm sure I'm not alone. Basically, I'd be a lot more likely to purchase $20-$50 in flex at a time because my PERCEIVED VALUE would be a lot greater. It certainly isn't that now. That's what the issue is about, not actual costs. The perception is now that PW owners/agents get hosed.

Originally posted by The Duff Man
Posted in that thread:



Obviously that is a huge amount of effort, and the history might not even be possible by anyone other than Bort.




I agree... and that's why I think it's going to be tough to come up with a Suggestion that will peak Bort's interest. Catch said in one of his posts on that thread that the suggestion has to make sense for GLB financially.... how in the heck can we know what makes sense for them financially?

The more I think about it.. I'm surprised Pee Wee isn't given ALOT more attention. Seems like it's the easiest way to get new agents "hooked" .. by offering them a playground to learn the basics of builds, game mechanics, and have competitive games. It should be recommended for new agents to spend some time at the lower levels to learn, instead of building players with limited game/build knowledge......, boosting, and then retiring them because their long term build is screwed up. The game should be cheaper at this level to entice new agents to stick around and because we don't get to experience some of the advanced build attibutes like VAs, and most SAs.

I don't want it to be free.. but it should not be MORE expensive

Originally posted by juiceweezl
I think the fact that you're overlooking involves the heavily committed owners/agents now. Several of us have a ton of players and would like to build more, own a team (again), etc., but we just won't do it because of the heavy cost of flex.

I'll use myself as an example.



I am not overlooking anything. Can you quantify your statement, because if you can that will help us get the ball rolling.

Don't take this the wrong way, because I just started playing PeeWee, run most of the team by myself and would LOVE for it to be cheaper.

Comments like yours above are probably very accurate, but difficult to quantify. If GLB can verify your comments they would be stupid not to change things. The problem is that it is impossible to verify your comments.

I suspect GLB has the impression they will lose money if they make it cheaper. The fastest way to get things changed is to present them with a business case that shows them otherwise.

EDB and I crunched some numbers twoseasons ago, how about the fact that 55% of players created each season just 3 seasons ago were peewee players, and that this season that number is down well below 40% of players created, that seems like pretty logical reason to reduce prices around 15% to me.

Originally posted by permastoned
EDB and I crunched some numbers twoseasons ago, how about the fact that 55% of players created each season just 3 seasons ago were peewee players, and that this season that number is down well below 40% of players created, that seems like pretty logical reason to reduce prices around 15% to me.

Which season was that? That wasn't the season where everybody got a free player was it? That would obviously mess up your numbers.

Originally posted by The Duff Man
I am not overlooking anything. Can you quantify your statement, because if you can that will help us get the ball rolling.

Don't take this the wrong way, because I just started playing PeeWee, run most of the team by myself and would LOVE for it to be cheaper.

Comments like yours above are probably very accurate, but difficult to quantify. If GLB can verify your comments they would be stupid not to change things. The problem is that it is impossible to verify your comments.

I suspect GLB has the impression they will lose money if they make it cheaper. The fastest way to get things changed is to present them with a business case that shows them otherwise.

I hear you, and unfortunately it's hard to quantify. I know that several of the DSBM owners are shrinking their number of players made each season if at all possible, and many aren't CEQ'ing anymore. Boosting has died off as well. I could poll our guys, but I don't think it's something we can point a hard number too. I do know that I just CEQ'd a lot of my guys this season because I retired 2 older dots. Without that, I wouldn't have CE'd them. I WILL NOT PURCHASE MORE FLEX FOR THE SAKE OF CREATING/BOOSTING/CE'ING ANYMORE PEEWEE DOTS. I put that in caps just in case Bort is listening.

Originally posted by PING72
Which season was that? That wasn't the season where everybody got a free player was it? That would obviously mess up your numbers.

It was season 15, it may have been when everyone was given a free player, but this would only prove more so that pee-wee cost need to be reduced, if a free player was more likely to go to a peewee team, if that is not the case then, indeed even more percent of total players are actually made just for pee-wees each season.

I think a more interesting counterpoint would be that primarily all of the flex cost for those peewee players has been paid ages ago and that they only make there profit off the custom equipment and boosting cost.

Essentially, by asking for a reduction on flex/boosting in pee-wee you are asking for a direct deduction to there profits, which anyone would be hesitant to do, particularly concerning its steady nature over the past few season.

I just can't see how the decline in peewee has not been noticed, this season only 2 copper leagues are even running, and there are leagues like the one that the Stingers are in, after having played my 2 hardest games on my schedule, with only 2 real games left I expect to average over 100 points a game scoring while giving up less than a touchdown for the season on that team, with no changes to a pretty good ai.

The point being that fantasy football is on a rise and this season, and def next season should be some of the strongest for goallineblitz, but considering peewee numbers got dropped by over 100 teams just this season is clearly an issue.

I think that something needs to be done, essentially they have given huge flex "deals" over times that would have lost them a higher % of their profit if really used a lot by the "well paying" bracket, than just reducing the prices on one and done players.

And essentially there is no doubt that peewee may be failing for other reasons than its cost, but considering the 10 20 page threads about it, it is obviously an issue and thus proposes the best idea I can see around for rescuing peewee.


I do however think they should remove the copper leagues since obviously the dual feeder system is no longer comprehensible for the demand to play the game.

It would be nice to see either some (1-2) "elite silver" leagues, or just a reduction of the number of silver leagues to increase competition.

I actually like the rivalry based promotion system, I think the reduced leagues will allow this to run its course easier.

My two cents, if people don't know my stance is $%@#$^$%@#$@# boosting and CE in the current system, pee wee specific. It just costs way way too much and isn't really fun to do so. I'll be boosting and Customing my team when the cost of it all goes down. For now I'm having fun with my little gold team, maybe we'll even stay in Gold for next year.

I'm not a poor dude, and could afford to fill an entire team if I really wanted to. Not saying this to brag, but I just don't want people to think that I'm a 14 year old living in their basement. I have a full time job, and pay my own rent. But the amount of money it costs is just too much to justify these said costs. I feel that we can still have fun not boosting, or using CE as much as we can without it.

I love GLB, but after what thunder66 said in a PF I created on this topic, the issue is borderline pointless. A bunch of suckers will continue to full boost their teams each year. Heck, forget suckers maybe those guys have money to burn for some reason.

I could buy a PS3 or like 8 video games for the cost to fund a full boost squad. Just not worth it to me, but maybe it is to others to get a nice pretty little gif. For me I've won a few trophies with my s14 silver team, and s16 cap 14 team, and I feel that I've accomplished a fair amount in a short time (started in s12), and defiantly had a great deal of fun.

Having said that, nothing tells a message stronger than example. That's what we are trying to set this year, and example that you don't have to pay extra to enjoy the game and find a moderate level of success. (Goal is to win 8 games and match last season's regular season total)

Again not slamming those who boost, please don't get me wrong, I just feel it isn't worth it in the long run. I look at it like paying an $100 to get loaded dice in Yatzhee, or Gold buying in a traditional MMORPG.

Hold on guys, my mom wants to say something.

Mr Bort or whatever you call yourself. Can you please for the love of God, lower the cost of pee wees? I had to increase Gaylords allowance every month it seems because he is hooked on some stupid internet game. My son could and should be doing better things with his time. I am sure you have made more than enough money dwindling money from these poor children to buy a house or 2 and some other nice toys. It's time to cut Gaylord and his friends some slack and let them play at a cheaper price so I can have some Bingo spending money. Now ask yourself Mr Bort, is that little 65 x65 picture really worth 100 dollars or more? About a month ago Gaylord was hootin and a hollering and I ran down to the basement to see what the fuss was all about and Gaylord had tears in his eyes. I asked him what was the matter, did you get your middle school report card since he has been in middle school for 4 years now and I though he finally gradiated but he said no mom, I just won the Pee Wee championship. What in the Devils name is a pee wee Championship? I knew I should of bought him one of those Z box thinga majiggys. Mr. Bort, lower your cost or I am gunna be forced to get him a game box. Thank you sir!

Originally posted by LordEvil
Hold on guys, my mom wants to say something.

Mr Bort or whatever you call yourself. Can you please for the love of God, lower the cost of pee wees? I had to increase Gaylords allowance every month it seems because he is hooked on some stupid internet game. My son could and should be doing better things with his time. I am sure you have made more than enough money dwindling money from these poor children to buy a house or 2 and some other nice toys. It's time to cut Gaylord and his friends some slack and let them play at a cheaper price so I can have some Bingo spending money. Now ask yourself Mr Bort, is that little 65 x65 picture really worth 100 dollars or more? About a month ago Gaylord was hootin and a hollering and I ran down to the basement to see what the fuss was all about and Gaylord had tears in his eyes. I asked him what was the matter, did you get your middle school report card since he has been in middle school for 4 years now and I though he finally gradiated but he said no mom, I just won the Pee Wee championship. What in the Devils name is a pee wee Championship? I knew I should of bought him one of those Z box thinga majiggys. Mr. Bort, lower your cost or I am gunna be forced to get him a game box. Thank you sir!

Hey Lord... Bort's over my house drinking beers and ..errr wait he wants to tell your mom something....

Dear Mrs. or Ms. Gaylord,

First of all if there is no father figure around please find one..there are many guys out there willing to hook up for a free place to stay and a warm body to um keep warm at night. This influence will more than keep young Gaylord out of trouble. However i have taken the steps to frustrate your son more than enough by doing several things. First off i have nerfed or in lamens terms took away Young Gays ability to win. Although he experienced the thrill of victory I have since made him and his teammates irrelevant, thus taking away most of the fun of the game. In other words if your son seems "hooked" on PeeWee football not only have i made this Crack i mean game so expensive it nearly kills Young Gaylord but also i have taken the thrill of the game away from him. It wont be too many more years of middle school until he will just give up on my gem of a game. Please dont address with me with any more of your concerns because im clearly in a higher tax bracket than you and I dont really care about your worries of financial or family problems. Please find a Daddy for young Gaylord and maybe if that ass is tapped enough you wont worry about Gays activities..thank you for your patronage.

lol that about sums it up as much as Bort and co gives a shit.