Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Theo Wizzago
I never go over 10. Why should someone? Makes no sense to me. SP's are precious and if going over 10 is diminishing returns, then it's wasted SP's IMO. :shrug: :sigh: (Still no new smileys. )

I'm going to correct myself a bit here. There are specific positions where having 15 in it is worth it. Returner dots with 15 in RETURN SPECIALIST is one of them. I'm guessing Kicker and Punter could also fit into this category. These dots are specific to one particular part of the game and really don't need most of the SA's out there available to most other dots. So pouring 15 into their highly specific game skill isn't a waste. (IMO)

that makes sense

Originally posted by Pen15
probably worth it if you have AEQ in the last SA of the tree, 3 pts in the SA, and it's 3 + 1 + 6 = 10... another 3 SP could take it to 11. everyone would probably agree that that's worth it, especially if it's something like Juke or Spin, but 4 SP to go from 11 to 12, probably not.


so is it overall consensus that 11 is fine for my rQB's Juke and Spin?
or is the line better drawn at 10? it doesnt seem the one extra SA would be that far diminished...

id only go 15 in First Step on a poss arch WR.

Actually 10 in a favored SA will see diminished returns. Your bonus from the favored status will be above 10 and its effect is diminished. I asked about it in a q&a and Bort answered. I previously thought the bonus was small, but with Catch recently stating the favored bonus is bigger than we thought, it leads me to believe it is worth 2 or more points in the SA. So maybe 8 or 9 in favored SAs would be more efficient to the build.

Originally posted by Qillar
Actually 10 in a favored SA will see diminished returns. Your bonus from the favored status will be above 10 and its effect is diminished. I asked about it in a q&a and Bort answered. I previously thought the bonus was small, but with Catch recently stating the favored bonus is bigger than we thought, it leads me to believe it is worth 2 or more points in the SA. So maybe 8 or 9 in favored SAs would be more efficient to the build.

Bort's answer stated that the bonus was applied after DR were checked... The outcome would be the opposite of what you said.

Not exactly how I interpret it. I asked if the bonus is also subject to DR over 10. He said yes it is. the bonus % is added on the value of the SA.
Looking at this again, I see the confusion. The reason I asked this was Bort stated the preferred SA was a set % bonus of the points in the SA. If the SA is a 5 and the bonus is 20%, the SA would act as it had 6 points. He didn't say the value of the preferred SA, but the points and he used an example.
So in this example, a 10 in a preferred SA is the same as a 12. Since we have diminishing returns over 10, I wondered if this would apply here also. That is why I asked, and Bort answered yes.

So if you think the bonus is 20% and you take it to 8, then it acts like 9.6. Take it to 9, and you have 10.8 with .8 diminished.

That is how I read it.

The question is on page 6 of the Sept 6 q&a.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4976524&page=6#46175123
that does clear it up a bit. so if not for the fact that preferred SAs are usually very important, the math types would recommend we take them to 8 or 9ish but not 10, yes?
seems kind of lame that the % bonus is added to the SA's value which just ends up functioning as a small SP-saver for those wary of diminishing returns, and not actually directly providing that SA's % bonus in the rolls instead. oh well

Originally posted by Pen15
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4976524&page=6#46175123
that does clear it up a bit. so if not for the fact that preferred SAs are usually very important, the math types would recommend we take them to 8 or 9ish but not 10, yes?
seems kind of lame that the % bonus is added to the SA's value which just ends up functioning as a small SP-saver for those wary of diminishing returns, and not actually directly providing that SA's % bonus in the rolls instead. oh well

actually if thats true it makes me glad that none of my AEQ will be in a favored SA for my QB

I'm pretty sure what Bort's answer means is this:

Let's say you have 12 in a SA. Diminishing returns make the actual value (this is just an approximation, not actual value) 11.5. The bonus is 20% (again, an approximation, not actual value). 20% of 11.5 is 2.3. The SA value would be 13.8. I do not believe he reduces the percentage of the bonus to be diminished (i.e. taking it from 20% to like 15%).

Thus, the bonus is not calculated on the total value of the SA but the calculated value after returns are diminished after 10. Not 100% sure on this but that's my interpretation. Probably best to ask at the next Q & A.

That was my interpretation as well. But it will be the 3rd time he answers it, and every time people can still interpret his answer in different ways...

Originally posted by Catch22
I'm pretty sure what Bort's answer means is this:

Let's say you have 12 in a SA. Diminishing returns make the actual value (this is just an approximation, not actual value) 11.5. The bonus is 20% (again, an approximation, not actual value). 20% of 11.5 is 2.3. The SA value would be 13.8. I do not believe he reduces the percentage of the bonus to be diminished (i.e. taking it from 20% to like 15%).

Thus, the bonus is not calculated on the total value of the SA but the calculated value after returns are diminished after 10. Not 100% sure on this but that's my interpretation. Probably best to ask at the next Q & A.

now explain YAC Attack.

Bort quote about the favoured / penalised SAs being modified after the diminishing returns above 10 are applied.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4784083&page=5#44198592

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Edit: Older quotes - not really relevant any more:

Catch quote on the favoured / penalised SAs being modified before the diminishing returns above 10 are applied.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4389170&page=2#39603380

People realise this is wrong:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4796923&page=1#44262993

And to answer the OP:

Originally posted by fogie55
most advice given here is that there is diminishing returns past 10 for SAs--but is there an exception for SAs that directly boost a primary attribute? if each point of a certain SA boosts that dot's speed, agility or whatever (if that's even how the SA works), would having the SA higher make sense?

example: CB with Return Specialist SA at 22 http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2255168 is this a waste or are there some SAs where there's a benefit to having it at 20+? if so, which others?

edit: punctuation for clarity

Bort/Catch quotes on SAs beyond around 12-15 being a bad idea. This question is often asked.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=3853045&page=2#34267592
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=3853045&page=3#34270564

Edit to add a Bort quote about attributes over 100 working fine:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1693878&page=3#13873405

I interpret the two questions I asked about SAs as the bonus is subject to diminishing returns. The question by dagwood13 says it is not.
I don't know, I still try to hit 10 anyways.