Warrior General Games

I've seen alot of guys say vision is over rated for WRs, guys who have wrs that have been very good.

I've even seen guys say that alot of vision can even be detremental to a WRs success.

It seems to me like it would be a natural thing for a WR to need high vision.

So I noticed that the Smooth Operator SA for CBs, which is next to last in the tree, applies a Vision penalty to WRs the guy is covering. Making me think that vision is quite important for a WR. If the next to last SA imposes a penalty agains it.

Any thoughts?

Yes wide receivers need vision.
Speed/agi come first. Then catching, then vision.
I also believe that confidence is underrated for wide receivers and jumping slightly overrated.

I'm not sold on vision, but like other attributes if you want to be sure you can beat the defender, your attribute needs to be higher than theirs whether it is strength, speed, catching, or stamina.

After reviewing my statement, I have to wonder about how vision plays into the catch. If it determines how fast both people break on the ball, yes, you want it high so you can break on it before the CB can. I'm not sure it does that though, and if it does, it is such a minute amount of time it practically doesn't make a difference. If it goes into the actual role modifier, what % does vision make up of that role? Are you better pointing a heavily weighted attribute more and ignoring vision or is vision enough of a % chunk of that pie that you want to get it up? I don't know, no one has put forth convincing evidence to support or refute these questions. IS vision like speed where the speed of a WRs and CBs speed can be directly compared? Or is vision like tackling attribute where a WR's strength/carrying/agility is the answer to avoiding the CBs high tackling rather than taking tackling to avoid tackling?

In my opinion:

Strength is not important for wide receivers at all, but carrying is for making the catch and obviously not fumbling. I also think it contributes to fluid movement in the same way agility does but to a much lesser extent.

Speed and agility are the most important attributes, and while there are several workable "ratios" some are better than others. If you're not an all out speedster your speed and agility should be somewhere near each other. This importance goes for all receiver types, not just speedsters and elusives (in other words, even possession receivers should value their movement attributes higher than their reception attributes.)

Jumping is only important for receivers who are covered heavily (talking a CB is breathing down your neck and a FS with ball hawk is 4 steps away before the pass) I think it can negate some of the value of an opponent's pass deflect roll, as well as interceptions. That said, many receiver builds could do completely without jumping because their goal is being open, not catching while covered.

And finally, vision is more important than catching. Let me explain before you go crazy.
Catching is the second contributor to a receiver being looked at/passed to; openness is the leading factor. Vision is somewhere on the scale but nowhere near as valuable to the QB as catching is. I think things like your relative level to your opponent and your overall ability (possibly even derived from the "bars" themselves if not some other calculation against theirs) also play a role.
Therefor if you have very high catching (much higher than your teammates) but are less open than they are by this assumption you will possibly be thrown to DESPITE your inability to catch the ball. I've seen it countless times, I'm not just blindly theorizing.
I think vision doesn't have this affect. I believe it helps you make the catch, via adding to your ability to adjust your stride well and anticipate not only where the ball will land but when it will be thrown as a general 'football sense' and synergy with your quarterback and team. It will tell you when to jump or dive, when to stop and start, how sharply you need to turn. And it does this while not making you appear very threatening, not be very high on the QB's assessment; as a result, when you are thrown to you are well equipped to handle catching the ball.

That's how I see it anyway.
And confidence obviously has value for any position but I'd rate receivers as the least in need of confidence. You shouldn't base decisions like raising confidence off of early career performance (drop sprees and morale spirals.) Those decisions should be made when your receiver has garnered some ability and you know whether or not his morale really suffers.

Originally posted by Daddy Warbucks
In my opinion:

Strength is not important for wide receivers at all, but carrying is for making the catch and obviously not fumbling. I also think it contributes to fluid movement in the same way agility does but to a much lesser extent.

Speed and agility are the most important attributes, and while there are several workable "ratios" some are better than others. If you're not an all out speedster your speed and agility should be somewhere near each other. This importance goes for all receiver types, not just speedsters and elusives (in other words, even possession receivers should value their movement attributes higher than their reception attributes.)

Jumping is only important for receivers who are covered heavily (talking a CB is breathing down your neck and a FS with ball hawk is 4 steps away before the pass) I think it can negate some of the value of an opponent's pass deflect roll, as well as interceptions. That said, many receiver builds could do completely without jumping because their goal is being open, not catching while covered.

And finally, vision is more important than catching. Let me explain before you go crazy.
Catching is the second contributor to a receiver being looked at/passed to; openness is the leading factor. Vision is somewhere on the scale but nowhere near as valuable to the QB as catching is. I think things like your relative level to your opponent and your overall ability (possibly even derived from the "bars" themselves if not some other calculation against theirs) also play a role.
Therefor if you have very high catching (much higher than your teammates) but are less open than they are by this assumption you will possibly be thrown to DESPITE your inability to catch the ball. I've seen it countless times, I'm not just blindly theorizing.
I think vision doesn't have this affect. I believe it helps you make the catch, via adding to your ability to adjust your stride well and anticipate not only where the ball will land but when it will be thrown as a general 'football sense' and synergy with your quarterback and team. It will tell you when to jump or dive, when to stop and start, how sharply you need to turn. And it does this while not making you appear very threatening, not be very high on the QB's assessment; as a result, when you are thrown to you are well equipped to handle catching the ball.

That's how I see it anyway.
And confidence obviously has value for any position but I'd rate receivers as the least in need of confidence. You shouldn't base decisions like raising confidence off of early career performance (drop sprees and morale spirals.) Those decisions should be made when your receiver has garnered some ability and you know whether or not his morale really suffers.

+1 Very nice post

I'm waiting to find a good WR with extremely low strength (under 15) and really high vision (60 or higher) that has exceptional production.

If anyone has a link I'd love to see it... hopefully a WR who's not a lvl 58 playing in a minor league.

Originally posted by The_Jonas
I'm waiting to find a good WR with extremely low strength (under 15) and really high vision (60 or higher) that has exceptional production.

If anyone has a link I'd love to see it... hopefully a WR who's not a lvl 58 playing in a minor league.

The best builds will not be open.

Originally posted by The_Jonas
I'm waiting to find a good WR with extremely low strength (under 15) and really high vision (60 or higher) that has exceptional production.

If anyone has a link I'd love to see it... hopefully a WR who's not a lvl 58 playing in a minor league.

I'll show you a low strength low vision one after season 11.

My WR will have low strength (trained probably to 30ish) and my vision will be very high. I'll also have ball hawk and football genius. In the end I assume it should be something like ~80 and over 100 after the pass up until the ball is caught.

I'll bookmark this thread so I can revive it with a post after my WR has some success.