A 4-2 cover 1 works well on this one too, although we've been crisped once on this play this season thus far. In that play, the LOT and the WR blocked out the speedy CB1 and the other defenders couldn't chase down the WR before he scored. Other than that one instance, the 4-2 is our preferred formation.
rlawrence
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Originally posted by Jaxx
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
JD_Stejskal
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Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
How can you know that the team is gonna a WR screen ?? that would really stupid of the OC.
4-3 is good at getting pressure on the QB, and I have had a DE cacth the wr with the ball.
you could also get better cbs, then they will slip past the blocker and get the ball carrier.
JD
Originally posted by Jaxx
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
How can you know that the team is gonna a WR screen ?? that would really stupid of the OC.
4-3 is good at getting pressure on the QB, and I have had a DE cacth the wr with the ball.
you could also get better cbs, then they will slip past the blocker and get the ball carrier.
JD
Sarg01
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Originally posted by rlawrence
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
Blanket statements are dumb. 4-3 Cover 0 is still 3 DBs covering 3 WRs. Just one of them is a safety instead of a CB. And in the strongside shift, the ROLB (you know, the guy you want trying to nuke the play?) doesn't move. Sure, a weakside shift would put him closer, but as others have said, the HB screen to the other direction is still pretty dangerous, and strongside shift is better at dealing with HB Slam.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
Blanket statements are dumb. 4-3 Cover 0 is still 3 DBs covering 3 WRs. Just one of them is a safety instead of a CB. And in the strongside shift, the ROLB (you know, the guy you want trying to nuke the play?) doesn't move. Sure, a weakside shift would put him closer, but as others have said, the HB screen to the other direction is still pretty dangerous, and strongside shift is better at dealing with HB Slam.
rlawrence
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4-3 strong shift is exactly what this man played, and why he posted in the first place. Maybe at your level of playing, 40+ players, it might work, but at our level, Oops, TD.
I don't think 4-3 is the best defense against a singleback system that throws a lot of WR screens. If they only ever run out of singleback, okay, give it a try.
If they throw out of singleback a lot, though, I think it's a big mistake.
I don't think 4-3 is the best defense against a singleback system that throws a lot of WR screens. If they only ever run out of singleback, okay, give it a try.
If they throw out of singleback a lot, though, I think it's a big mistake.
Sarg01
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But he didn't play Cover 0. So he did leave a WR uncovered and that WR proceeded to block the only guy in that part of the field, leaving the screen catcher free to run. Cover 0 would have dropped a safety down there.
I think I see the source of the misunderstanding. You're looking for a defense with no weaknesses so it can be run all the time against singleback no matter what the opponent likes to do. No such D exists. You pretty much have to have a different gameplan for each competitive opponent if you want your D to be successful.
I think I see the source of the misunderstanding. You're looking for a defense with no weaknesses so it can be run all the time against singleback no matter what the opponent likes to do. No such D exists. You pretty much have to have a different gameplan for each competitive opponent if you want your D to be successful.
Last edited Jan 14, 2009 15:01:10
rlawrence
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yeah, lately I've been facing guys that have a lot of variety with their singleback formations, and you pretty much pegged me.
seanb1979
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Originally posted by vondolin
If you use a dime defense against the single back formation, the screen usually gets squashed pretty easily, because the blocking WR gets overloaded. However, good scouting would help to find out how often and in what situations the other team is running the screen, so you can plan a little better.
As ddingo stated, not using a 4-3 would be your starting point!
Singleback dive will tear you a new asshole if you run dime on it.
If you use a dime defense against the single back formation, the screen usually gets squashed pretty easily, because the blocking WR gets overloaded. However, good scouting would help to find out how often and in what situations the other team is running the screen, so you can plan a little better.
As ddingo stated, not using a 4-3 would be your starting point!
Singleback dive will tear you a new asshole if you run dime on it.
seanb1979
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Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
4-3 cover 0 works against singleback if you know they run a lot and your FS is a stud at coverage. I'd only run it if I knew they ran most of the time in that situation.
3-4 cover 0 is a good one too, particularly because my rolb is my best linebacker and can make plays on the wr screen.
Originally posted by Jaxx
Originally posted by rlawrence
Originally posted by Jaxx
You can use a 4-3 defense, Cover 0, man to man with strong side shift and I have found that will stop it just leaves you open to a couple other plays is the problem.
FAIL
Why don't you try playing or GM'ing for a team in a higher league before you pass judgments. I use that very setup on my team in USA AAA against harder opponents than you will play all season. It works with proper builds.
um .. no. 4-3 against 3 wide is dumb. That, and now you want to shift the linebackers away from the play.
As a matter of fact, if you'd looked at the play he was asking about, he had played 4-3 strong shift, and that's what got him killed.
4-3 cover 0 works against singleback if you know they run a lot and your FS is a stud at coverage. I'd only run it if I knew they ran most of the time in that situation.
3-4 cover 0 is a good one too, particularly because my rolb is my best linebacker and can make plays on the wr screen.
AC
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A little help, what should I change to the defense to stop the WR screen...
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=356663&pbp_id=9846475
other than get better players
edit: 3-3-5 with C2 stacked has already been suggested. I'll try that and see if it works. But I bet the LB sprints the wrong direction on pitches. We will see.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=356663&pbp_id=9846475
other than get better players
edit: 3-3-5 with C2 stacked has already been suggested. I'll try that and see if it works. But I bet the LB sprints the wrong direction on pitches. We will see.
Last edited Jan 24, 2009 15:37:59
Jaxx
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Wow those are perhaps the slowest CB's and safeties I have seen even for level 20's. The only other thing I can think of without knowing your players builds is to run the preselect play's either DE contain or LB flats. I hate pre selected plays myself but it should help until you can get some more speed agility and vision on your CB's and Safeties to come off their respective blocks and blow that play up.
OttawaShane
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335 cover 1 or cover 0. Cover 1 gets an extra CB on that side of the field while still protecting you against runs up the middle or to the far side of the field. Cover0 totally overloads those receivers so there will be a defender free to make the tackle.
seanb1979
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Originally posted by OttawaShane
335 cover 1 or cover 0. Cover 1 gets an extra CB on that side of the field while still protecting you against runs up the middle or to the far side of the field. Cover0 totally overloads those receivers so there will be a defender free to make the tackle.
Cover 0 blitzing the 3rd cb can be fun too.
335 cover 1 or cover 0. Cover 1 gets an extra CB on that side of the field while still protecting you against runs up the middle or to the far side of the field. Cover0 totally overloads those receivers so there will be a defender free to make the tackle.
Cover 0 blitzing the 3rd cb can be fun too.
sirmixalotswass
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The play he ran was a 4-3 ZONE, you can tell since there is no one playing man on the 3rd reciever. strong or weak shifts wont help if you play a 4-3 zone agasint a 3 reciever set. 3+ reciever sets in a zone leave too many holes and the offense will exploit it.
4-3 with a very fast ROLB isnt a bad idea if your CBs are worse, IMO(considering the state of recruiting this could be it, since his CB is 7 lvls lower than the ROLB, but cant confirm with closed builds)
If you use a different package than nickel or dime agasint 3 WR i suggest man under coverage. and avoid blitzing the ROLB if you have scouted and the team runs the WR screen. If you ROLB also has decent STR/AGI he will demolish the blocking WR and blow the play up.
Over all blitzing on a screen is a bad idea since that is exactly what a screen's purpose is to counter. Allow the blitz to penetrate and throw away from it. But still using a C0 will force the FS to double team the WR and give an extra man over there to attempt a tackle.
4-3 with a very fast ROLB isnt a bad idea if your CBs are worse, IMO(considering the state of recruiting this could be it, since his CB is 7 lvls lower than the ROLB, but cant confirm with closed builds)
If you use a different package than nickel or dime agasint 3 WR i suggest man under coverage. and avoid blitzing the ROLB if you have scouted and the team runs the WR screen. If you ROLB also has decent STR/AGI he will demolish the blocking WR and blow the play up.
Over all blitzing on a screen is a bad idea since that is exactly what a screen's purpose is to counter. Allow the blitz to penetrate and throw away from it. But still using a C0 will force the FS to double team the WR and give an extra man over there to attempt a tackle.
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