Warrior General Games

Originally posted by chronoaug
Yea, the widespread bitchfest wasn't happening quite as much in the fall. I don't really think it's going to get better though. I think people were just expecting more consistency, transparency, realism, balance, etc... after over a year.

It's hard to seem optimistic about the future of the sim as well when you see accidents like this happen just by trying to fix one aspect of the sim. I'd feel more hopeful if there were hired professional coders, game developers and/or dedicated testers (and maybe no VAs for a little bit) but i doubt that'll happen. I've retired guys in the past and probably won't really make more players. Just wait till my current high level retires and use his flex to fund the lower one's boosts till his career is over or maybe create a casual player.




Agreed

Originally posted by jtserb
Originally posted by datongw

Man, INTs just don't happen out of the blue. You have to code them for them to happen, that is all that I am saying. Draw your own conclusion about what Bort says, I have mine, you can agree or disagree.

If Bort wants to eliminate the INT after knocked loose, all he needs to do is to remove the INT code after the knocked loose.

The sim does not have a mind of its own, it's freaking program and it will does what the programmer tells it to do.


Eh, minor very very minor coding experience in my lifetime and im not sure of your qualifications so excuse me if I am wrong, but isn't it possible that the code isn't in your order? What if INT and PD and INT are in the same code. Do they have to be seperate codes INT and KL INT's? What if they are not? Then eliminating the KL INT's would eliminate INT"s all together? Does this make sense?

Bort probably have INT as a function and just calls it whenever he wants to do an INT check, so INT and KL INT could be the same block of code. However, he still needs to reference to that block of code (call it) if he wants to run an INT check, so as long as he doesn't check for INTs after the ball is knocked loose, it doesn't effect normal INTs.

Again, I don't know how Bort coded this, but logically speaking, this should not be difficult to fix.

Originally posted by Galkuris
Originally posted by Saris

It's probably something like pitches using the same logic as a knocked loose pass. Then when he changes how defenders react to pitches on 5/14, inadvertently it changes the interception dynamic when the ball is knocked loose. I don't think it was an intentional change anyway.

Underrated post imo. Often times changing one section of code can have an effect on another part. Coding a game like this is not as simple as:

Pass thrown;
check for int;
check for deflection;
.
.
.
check for knock loose;
check for INT after knock loose;


I can guarantee that.

Now, that doesn't excuse this issue, and it IS a problem for teams that actually like to pass more often. Maybe you haven't noticed but the three teams that are sitting at the top right nowin the West...love to run it as much as possible. Heck, even the #4 team likes to run it, but we had more of a risk/reward type offense on first, so this change murdered us when we got the risk side and had to pass on 2nd/3rd downs. Heck, even the fast rising team of Texas made their biggest wins (WW, Compton, Drinkin) after the change...and they too rely heavily on the running game.

I agree that the code for a game like this is not as simple as that. However, if the game is coded right, this type of bug is very easy to catch. We are not talking about a weird behavior of the dot while running or OT/DE interaction which involves checking of many attributes, we are talking about a specific action at a very specific point of the code sequence, should be very easy to track down.

Originally posted by xManning1018x
Originally posted by lawdawg95

I'd like to know how many WRs that are falling victim to this have carrying capped at 2nd level.

You had LBs and Safeties jacking up their strength and tackling to deal with the power run game of S7 and S8 but how many WRs were keeping pace by cranking up carrying? My guess is not many.

How many passes are intercepted after a deflection in real life? That's more of the issue here. I love the increase in knocking the ball loose but not the idiotic interceptions that result.

This is all we should be talking about.

Knocking the ball loose: great.
2-3 INTs a game off of KLs: stupid, unrealistic, unintended and (Bort has admitted both of these) a coding accident and not build related.

Originally posted by datongw
Originally posted by Galkuris

Originally posted by Saris


It's probably something like pitches using the same logic as a knocked loose pass. Then when he changes how defenders react to pitches on 5/14, inadvertently it changes the interception dynamic when the ball is knocked loose. I don't think it was an intentional change anyway.

Underrated post imo. Often times changing one section of code can have an effect on another part. Coding a game like this is not as simple as:

Pass thrown;
check for int;
check for deflection;
.
.
.
check for knock loose;
check for INT after knock loose;


I can guarantee that.

Now, that doesn't excuse this issue, and it IS a problem for teams that actually like to pass more often. Maybe you haven't noticed but the three teams that are sitting at the top right nowin the West...love to run it as much as possible. Heck, even the #4 team likes to run it, but we had more of a risk/reward type offense on first, so this change murdered us when we got the risk side and had to pass on 2nd/3rd downs. Heck, even the fast rising team of Texas made their biggest wins (WW, Compton, Drinkin) after the change...and they too rely heavily on the running game.

I agree that the code for a game like this is not as simple as that. However, if the game is coded right, this type of bug is very easy to catch. We are not talking about a weird behavior of the dot while running or OT/DE interaction which involves checking of many attributes, we are talking about a specific action at a very specific point of the code sequence, should be very easy to track down.


From his recent attempts to 'fix' the problem, he wants these to happen, just not as often.

Raising the vision checks after the knocked loose for the defenders to 'see' the ball in the air. But as I recall, raising it didn't help much and they still showed up.

Originally posted by lawdawg95
Originally posted by islander1

Originally posted by lawdawg95


Originally posted by islander1



I guess what it comes down to for me, is this 'game' stopped actually being fun sometime in season 8.
Which is why it's probably time for me to wrap things up from a management standpoint.

I've told many people the same thing for the last 2 seasons. Honestly I was very close last season but it's pretty hard to sell the team after you JUST made Pro.

The thing is, ultimately its not the losing that makes it 'unfun'.

It's the continually broken sims, the epicly slow response time to fixing the issues that need fixing, and then the abiity to create a new game breaking sim code mistake 80% of the time in process of fixing the original problem.

Additionally I do think the grind of the season (and scrimmages) contribute more then I'd like to admit. This last week was brutal. Early in the season when we had all our PWT round robins lined up was a rough week also because defensively I was struggling.


I agree with you more than you think. But for me it's all the incessant griping throughout GLB that makes this a lot less fun to me.

Didn't mean to take it out on ya, just frustrates the holy hell out of me sometimes. The inescapable fact though is that this game is headed straight for the shitter.





Ask yourself this question:

Have you ever heard of someone who gave up their team and regretted their decision?

I havent regretted ending my own team, so no.
However, I am still (to this day) saddened that it's what I had to do (back in season 6).
I enjoyed running it, just couldn't do it by myself any longer.

Originally posted by kr0n
From his recent attempts to 'fix' the problem, he wants these to happen, just not as often.

Raising the vision checks after the knocked loose for the defenders to 'see' the ball in the air. But as I recall, raising it didn't help much and they still showed up.

I think half the problem is the simulation that every pass deflection and every KL has the ball being popped way up the air, free for grabs. Post-deflection receptions and post-KL INTs happen at about the same (perhaps even greater for post-KL INTs) frequency as they do for normally thrown balls. Judging by my perception that they happen at a similar frequency, no defender ever just bats the ball down to the ground and no receiver ever just drops the ball when he's hit. Add in the way VAs make players play at +30-50% greater than human from one play to the next, and you get comical arcade-style results without all the cool graphics. Woo. Hoo.


I also agree with those (everyone?) who are disappointed in the negativity that has descended on this game, particularly at the highest levels of play - although I focus more on the cause than the result. I think the constant negativity reflects pessimism, much like my own, that this game isn't progressing at a reasonable pace. I know I kicked in a fair amount of cash early on to help this game develop, and it looks like Bort was quite happy to collect my contribution along with everyone else's here and keep it for himself... not hiring any talent to move the game forward and not even adhering to commonly-accepted software QA practices. Not understanding how or when he introduces unwanted effects in the code is troubling; not taking action to make this game approach his customers' expectations is unacceptable imo.

I continue to play because the entertainment value is still greater than zero, although for me it now falls well short of value for further flex point purchases. At this point I'm merely riding the "sunk cost" from the days of early optimism. It still occupies time when I'm bored but it's no longer something I look forward to while I'm busy doing other things. It's become pretty much equal to watching mindless TV programming for me. It won't be long until the recycled flex runs out and my negativity will fade away... along with the content I generate for the game. Even worse: it's losing the user-generated content that makes me the most pessimistic about GLB's future, fueling the destructive feedback loop you see unfolding today.

double edit: speling iz harrd.

I don't see bort ever hiring professionals to test and code really. I'm not sure of his business plan but i can't really see that much room for growth at this stage, especially with how buggy it is and how he doesn't even know what's going to happen as levels get higher.

I guess there's a chance he has been working on a separate sim to go to when he wipes the game and maybe get it going for the start of the football season when everyone loves football and it's the best chance to get new customers through advertising. But seeing how things have worked so far, i'm guessing he's not being quite that crafty.

Bort adds little bells and whistles like tv revenue, VAs, and d play creator but it seems like the game in its current form has kind of maxed out from a growth and money standpoint

Bort needs to hire programers from Japan. GLB would be perfect!

The passing game gas been shit since way before 5/14, try 5/2. Throwing to a WR or TE into zone coverage is a recipe for disaster. The passing game was a viable option at the start of the season, not anymore....

Originally posted by xcoach2
The passing game gas been shit since way before 5/14, try 5/2. Throwing to a WR or TE into zone coverage is a recipe for disaster. The passing game was a viable option at the start of the season, not anymore....

pretty much

Originally posted by Painmaker
Originally posted by kr0n

From his recent attempts to 'fix' the problem, he wants these to happen, just not as often.

Raising the vision checks after the knocked loose for the defenders to 'see' the ball in the air. But as I recall, raising it didn't help much and they still showed up.

I think half the problem is the simulation that every pass deflection and every KL has the ball being popped way up the air, free for grabs. Post-deflection receptions and post-KL INTs happen at about the same (perhaps even greater for post-KL INTs) frequency as they do for normally thrown balls. Judging by my perception that they happen at a similar frequency, no defender ever just bats the ball down to the ground and no receiver ever just drops the ball when he's hit. Add in the way VAs make players play at +30-50% greater than human from one play to the next, and you get comical arcade-style results without all the cool graphics. Woo. Hoo.


I also agree with those (everyone?) who are disappointed in the negativity that has descended on this game, particularly at the highest levels of play - although I focus more on the cause than the result. I think the constant negativity reflects pessimism, much like my own, that this game isn't progressing at a reasonable pace. I know I kicked in a fair amount of cash early on to help this game develop, and it looks like Bort was quite happy to collect my contribution along with everyone else's here and keep it for himself... not hiring any talent to move the game forward and not even adhering to commonly-accepted software QA practices. Not understanding how or when he introduces unwanted effects in the code is troubling; not taking action to make this game approach his customers' expectations is unacceptable imo.

I continue to play because the entertainment value is still greater than zero, although for me it now falls well short of value for further flex point purchases. At this point I'm merely riding the "sunk cost" from the days of early optimism. It still occupies time when I'm bored but it's no longer something I look forward to while I'm busy doing other things. It's become pretty much equal to watching mindless TV programming for me. It won't be long until the recycled flex runs out and my negativity will fade away... along with the content I generate for the game. Even worse: it's losing the user-generated content that makes me the most pessimistic about GLB's future, fueling the destructive feedback loop you see unfolding today.

double edit: speling iz harrd.

+1 pretty much feel the same way.