Warrior General Games

*Removed general snark*

Originally posted by Signalsgt
So the general consensus is DE's are still broken, right?



But yes, DEs are still overmatched by OTs who can hold you for the entire play with no chance of shedding the block.

Maybe if the Shed Block SA worked with any sort of regularity...


*editted*

Originally posted by bluto
[But yes, DEs are still overmatched by OTs who can hold you for the entire play with no chance of shedding the block.

Maybe if the Shed Block SA worked with any sort of regularity...

Your right, I went ahead and removed it. Just annoyed that he questioned the build then decided to claim I didn't do the research. When the data clearly shows how broken the DE's are this season. As long as people like BB mis-represent facts the game will be broken, we need clear concise examples to give to Bort so he can make the code tweaks.

Originally posted by bluto
Originally posted by Signalsgt

So the general consensus is DE's are still broken and the "fix" is in BB's head along with unicorns, leprechauns and bigfoot right?

C'mon man...that's not cool.

But yes, DEs are still overmatched by OTs who can hold you for the entire play with no chance of shedding the block.

Maybe if the Shed Block SA worked with any sort of regularity...

I do not think it is just that the Shed Block SA does not work...from what I understand all d-linmen have a certain chance to shed blocks and the SA is only a bonus to the shed block formula. The formula likely consists of agility, strength, blocking, SAs vs the OT counter abilities. Right now it would seem the formula is heavily weighted for OT success as OTs can seemingly hold blocks forever.

It seems these changes were made simply so the DEs do not rack up sack totals. The side effect is now offenses pass and score at will and running also got a boost because o linemen can hold blocks as the RB runs right through/past the d-line. IMO this change more than anything has really hurt the game play this year...any proficient offensive coordinator can figure out a way for their team to put up 50+ points a game.

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by bluto

[But yes, DEs are still overmatched by OTs who can hold you for the entire play with no chance of shedding the block.

Maybe if the Shed Block SA worked with any sort of regularity...

Your right, I went ahead and removed it. Just annoyed that he questioned the build then decided to claim I didn't do the research. When the data clearly shows how broken the DE's are this season. As long as people like BB mis-represent facts the game will be broken, we need clear concise examples to give to Bort so he can make the code tweaks.


Man, I was the revolutionary father for DEs to be unnerf, and now I'm suppose to be this bad guy that is holding your DEs back.

It is very reasonable for OT with high blocking and high strength to hold up your DE. You can't simply argue that high spd/agi combo should beat high str/blc combo based on "real life experiences." This is GLB and we live with the good and the bad. I, for one, welcome Bort's algorithm if it really is just str/blc vs. spd/agi. If we cookie-build our DEs with spd/agi only, then OTs should be allowed to cookie-counter with str/blc. Sounds fair to me.

Some people here expect DE with 25 str, 90 spd, 70 agi to excel and rack up sacks. Then why not expect OT with 25 spd, 90 str, and 70 blc to pancake your ass?

I for one am glad Bort has rework the algorithm to allow chess-matches like this. I just don't see any validity in the attitude that anybody's DE is above reproach and putting up 1s or 0s is a grave sin.

Originally posted by Shelby Delby
Sorry BB, DLight is right.

Your 3 sack game was against an OT with an open build...he had 25 spd.

So...14 sacks against gutteds...3 sacks against a guy who couldn't beat Oprah in a foot race.

No diserespect intended...but data prooves you wrong on this count.

Lesson learned for me to be too trusting.

You are either a liar, an idiot, or both.

The LOT I went up against has an open build, but his attributes are:

str = 72
spd = 49
agi = 51
blc = 70

Definitely a solid LOT for lvl 34. Definitely not spd = 25

Do you really like to lie like this to make a case and not think people will call you out on them?

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by bluto

[But yes, DEs are still overmatched by OTs who can hold you for the entire play with no chance of shedding the block.

Maybe if the Shed Block SA worked with any sort of regularity...

Your right, I went ahead and removed it. Just annoyed that he questioned the build then decided to claim I didn't do the research. When the data clearly shows how broken the DE's are this season. As long as people like BB mis-represent facts the game will be broken, we need clear concise examples to give to Bort so he can make the code tweaks.

Clear example:

My DE with 74 spd and 69 agi was able to beat a LOT with 72 str, 49 spd, 50 agi, and 70 blc

That looks pretty even to me.

Originally posted by BiggerBlue
Originally posted by Shelby Delby

Sorry BB, DLight is right.

Your 3 sack game was against an OT with an open build...he had 25 spd.

So...14 sacks against gutteds...3 sacks against a guy who couldn't beat Oprah in a foot race.

No diserespect intended...but data prooves you wrong on this count.

Lesson learned for me to be too trusting.

You are either a liar, an idiot, or both.

The LOT I went up against has an open build, but his attributes are:

str = 72
spd = 49
agi = 51
blc = 70

Definitely a solid LOT for lvl 34. Definitely not spd = 25

Do you really like to lie like this to make a case and not think people will call you out on them?


Now your starting to piss me off. Before you go running your mouth, how about YOU do some research on YOUR player instead of the rest of us having to fact check you at every turn since you are continually wrong.

Here are your self-proclaimed sacks against EVEN builds:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8508878 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8509751 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=350636

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8512774 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881

Look at the friggen NAME of the player you lined up against THEN go check his build. BOTH of the LOT have their builds open so your further digging your grave with the shovel of stupidity.

So yes I'm going to call you out because your completely obtuse to facts. Your wrong, admit it so we can move on.

So by my count, you got ONE valid sack out of 65 plays.

Originally posted by BiggerBlue
Originally posted by Shelby Delby

Sorry BB, DLight is right.

Your 3 sack game was against an OT with an open build...he had 25 spd.

So...14 sacks against gutteds...3 sacks against a guy who couldn't beat Oprah in a foot race.

No diserespect intended...but data prooves you wrong on this count.

Lesson learned for me to be too trusting.

You are either a liar, an idiot, or both.

The LOT I went up against has an open build, but his attributes are:

str = 72
spd = 49
agi = 51
blc = 70

Definitely a solid LOT for lvl 34. Definitely not spd = 25

Do you really like to lie like this to make a case and not think people will call you out on them?



Shelby wasn't lying. Look again...2 of your 3 were against the backup with the open build...25 spd.

Now play nice please.

It's true, you should probably check to make sure you're right before saying a player does or doesn't have 25 speed. You got 1 sack against their starter with 49 spd.

Originally posted by Motiak
It's true, you should probably check to make sure you're right before saying a player does or doesn't have 25 speed. You got 0 sacks against their starter with 49 spd.

He got one, this play: http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8509751

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by Motiak

It's true, you should probably check to make sure you're right before saying a player does or doesn't have 25 speed. You got 0 sacks against their starter with 49 spd.

He got one, this play: http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8509751



It's true, I should probably check to make sure I'm right before I say his player did or didn't get 0 sacks against their starter. Thus I sneakily editted.

It's not nice to call a lady names, BiggerBlue...especially when she's right.

Thanks for backing up my research everybody...perhaps BiggerBlue will do some of his own next time before he calls somebody an idiot/liar/both.

(anyone else LOL'ing that a mid 30's level DE doesn't have more than 80 in either primary stat? )

Originally posted by Shelby Delby
It's not nice to call a lady names, BiggerBlue...especially when she's right.

Thanks for backing up my research everybody...perhaps BiggerBlue will do some of his own next time before he calls somebody an idiot/liar/both.

(anyone else LOL'ing that a mid 30's level DE doesn't have more than 80 in either primary stat? )

No but I did give it the snort it was due