Warrior General Games

I typically think a little outside of the box and personally don't see confidence as being a simple attribute that only effects your morale during the sim. I see it more of a buffer of sorts, that effects your attributes. Based on logic (which is usually a stretch) here's an example of what i think.

Some examples

High vision + low confidence - sure you may be able to read the play, but do you believe in your ability enough to act on it quickly and make the play? lower confidence players will still react using the same read, but a player with higher confidence will have less hesitation.

High Strength + low confidence vs High Strength + high confidence - The high confidence guy has the attitude of "I'm strong, stronger then you, and im gonna beast you" , where the low confidence guy would be more of a "I'm strong, but he is strong too". This would again cause hesitation from the self doubt.

High Carry + low confidence - low confidence (2 hands on the ball at all times, keep it tucked away). high confidence, "im damn good at holding onto the ball" (not afraid to "make the big play", stretch out and get the TD vs trying to fall into the endzone.

obviously these all could not be shown in the sim through dots, but the dots are only a reflection of how the equation of the play worked out, they're not exactly what happened in the sim. again I have just a small amount of proof that backs this up, but logically it makes sense to me.

Vallic, that actually goes with the current hypothesis I have going. High confidence would actually give a slight boost to all other attributes. In your example, Confidence would make all other attributes work at 100% effectiveness. Same thing basically, just a different way to look at it.

I don't have a whole lot of proof granted, but that HB that had 160 broken tackles with nothing besides confidence kind of makes me wonder. I also had an experiment HB for awhile that only had confidence, and he seemed to run much faster than a person with 13 speed/11 agility would normally run, along with several broken tackles with 12 strength and 11 carrying.

If vision doesn't allow you to see openings and react to them, then what is this? http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=285893&pbp_id=12400380

Originally posted by voltageaav
If vision doesn't allow you to see openings and react to them, then what is this? http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=285893&pbp_id=12400380

The LB making the read after the play had already started...which I've seen similar plays made by my SS with 12 vision.

It also looks like he may have gotten juked.

For example,
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=228814&pbp_id=11211594

That SS has 12 vision.

In watching game film with low confidence players, I've often wondered if there is some kind of 'confidence check' before a player commits to an action (ie a HB hitting a hole, a SS moving in for the tackle as opposed to waiting for the HB to reach him, a QB trying a tough pass)

No proof at all, just a feeling.

Originally posted by rlawrence
In watching game film with low confidence players, I've often wondered if there is some kind of 'confidence check' before a player commits to an action (ie a HB hitting a hole, a SS moving in for the tackle as opposed to waiting for the HB to reach him, a QB trying a tough pass)

No proof at all, just a feeling.

this is what im fairly convinced of. i don't commit to confidence on any of my guys, but none of them neglect it.

I'm pretty sure morale modifies all results just like energy does, and confidence is tied to morale just like stamina is to energy.

Morale bar fluctuates alot in game, jsut like stamina.

I always treat confidence as a 2nd stamina trait.

Of course there are benefits i'm sure.

Originally posted by Vallic
I typically think a little outside of the box and personally don't see confidence as being a simple attribute that only effects your morale during the sim. I see it more of a buffer of sorts, that effects your attributes. Based on logic (which is usually a stretch) here's an example of what i think.

Some examples

High vision + low confidence - sure you may be able to read the play, but do you believe in your ability enough to act on it quickly and make the play? lower confidence players will still react using the same read, but a player with higher confidence will have less hesitation.

High Strength + low confidence vs High Strength + high confidence - The high confidence guy has the attitude of "I'm strong, stronger then you, and im gonna beast you" , where the low confidence guy would be more of a "I'm strong, but he is strong too". This would again cause hesitation from the self doubt.

High Carry + low confidence - low confidence (2 hands on the ball at all times, keep it tucked away). high confidence, "im damn good at holding onto the ball" (not afraid to "make the big play", stretch out and get the TD vs trying to fall into the endzone.

obviously these all could not be shown in the sim through dots, but the dots are only a reflection of how the equation of the play worked out, they're not exactly what happened in the sim. again I have just a small amount of proof that backs this up, but logically it makes sense to me.

this is my idea of how confidence works also. i think it probably causes your SAs to fire more often too. if you know that you're Juke move is nasty you're much more likely to use it.

bort made subsequent comments since the comment "confidence is the most underrated attribute"...... this comment was because nobody put any points into confidence. after bort made that comment, people went a bit overboard and starting spending SP there. at either the middle or end of last season, bort said confidence was no longer the most underrated..... i forgot if / what he opined was at that time now that confidence was not.

now that there are new vet abilities, you can spend points in them to reduce your chances of missing tackles, which reduces your need for confidence because that is what gets lowered. my lvl 40 OLB has 33 in conf and only misses maybe 3 tackles per season (except for one season where I missed 7). So confidence doesnt need to be that high, but could use a few points from training, not SPs.

I have still not heard of anything else that reduces an LBs morale unless it is the type of thing that would reduce a teams overall morale in game. Maybe if you get juked or head faked, but i've still never heard of it reducing your morale.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by voltageaav

If vision doesn't allow you to see openings and react to them, then what is this? http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=285893&pbp_id=12400380

The LB making the read after the play had already started...which I've seen similar plays made by my SS with 12 vision.

It also looks like he may have gotten juked.

For example,
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=228814&pbp_id=11211594

That SS has 12 vision.

I'm on a team where I have a FS with 68 vision, 7 Super Vision, and there's a SS with 38 vision.

After watching about 20 pass replays, both safeties react at the EXACT same time to the play. They react the same to the pass being thrown, the handoff, etc.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Guppy, Inc


I'm beginning to lean this way too. I havent noticed big differences in play between low vision and high vision guys. The sim is coded for the same pathing pretty much no matter level you are.

My 24 LB has 80 vision and 60 agility, and reacts just as quick to plays, if not slower than my SS with 12 vision.

The only thing vision MAY help with is getting faked.

See what happen with a QB with high Pump Fake. Your SS is toast.

eitherway, i'm going to put my points into vision until 60 (currently 52), while i train my confidence (currently 32).

This is mostly because after mods of equip, and vet abilities.... my speed is 86, and agility is 83. tackling+strength are in the 50s, jumping in the mid 30s. Catching in the high 20s.

So i'll be training my confidence, and my stamina from here on out .

I do this because i do believe their is a confidence check after the vision check for a play. If your LB (or i guess a saftey) doesn't have the confidence to jump on a play, ... they aren't, they are going to run the play text book style.

So if one player has 60 vision, and another has 30 vision... and they both have 20 confidence, they will only take chances that will be safe with their confidence level. A safety playing a deep zone with 20 confidence will hesitate to break off his zone to chase down what he thinks he sees might be a pitch. So they will both play the same textbook style, wait for the RB to turn the corner and look for the ball in his hands.

Thats how i see it, i however have not built my LB that way BTW. I did the high speed, high agility route before all else. but now in my 7th season... i don't have much else to do.

I think con affects a lot of things, but I'd never personally invest even a single SP into it.
Cost vs gain too high.

Originally posted by Vallic
I typically think a little outside of the box and personally don't see confidence as being a simple attribute that only effects your morale during the sim. I see it more of a buffer of sorts, that effects your attributes. Based on logic (which is usually a stretch) here's an example of what i think.

Some examples

High vision + low confidence - sure you may be able to read the play, but do you believe in your ability enough to act on it quickly and make the play? lower confidence players will still react using the same read, but a player with higher confidence will have less hesitation.

High Strength + low confidence vs High Strength + high confidence - The high confidence guy has the attitude of "I'm strong, stronger then you, and im gonna beast you" , where the low confidence guy would be more of a "I'm strong, but he is strong too". This would again cause hesitation from the self doubt.

High Carry + low confidence - low confidence (2 hands on the ball at all times, keep it tucked away). high confidence, "im damn good at holding onto the ball" (not afraid to "make the big play", stretch out and get the TD vs trying to fall into the endzone.

obviously these all could not be shown in the sim through dots, but the dots are only a reflection of how the equation of the play worked out, they're not exactly what happened in the sim. again I have just a small amount of proof that backs this up, but logically it makes sense to me.

this also would agree with how important confidence is for kickers. they need to have the confidence to say "i can put this through the pipes for my team" attitude. so i can definitely see this occuring on a smaller scale for all plays in the sim.