Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Dr. E
Got to wonder one thing, is 88.52 confidence high. When Bort was conjuring up the math for morale, did he consider that high?

how high does he want the 4th most important attribute for a QB

Originally posted by Dr. E
Got to wonder one thing, is 88.52 confidence high. When Bort was conjuring up the math for morale, did he consider that high?

You're asking the wrong question.

The real question is... when it comes to morale-turnover spirals, why does there seem to be no difference whether a player has 88 Confidence or 28 Confidence? Coz back in the day when these spirals were commonplace, it didn't seem to matter at all how much Confidence you had -- which is what made the "fix ur builds" crowd so asinine in that debate. For people who felt that builds mattered so much, they sure couldn't be bothered to actually look at any actual builds.

Originally posted by jdbolick

No, committing a turnover absolutely shouldn't make you more likely to have another. That's not only completely unrealistic, but it's exactly what is causing the problem. The only thing that will ever fix turnover cascades definitively is to make all turnovers always dependent just on the builds involved.



Is it that the player is more likely to commit another turnover due to morale spiral or could it be that the defense is more likely to cause one due to a morale boost? Or even a combination of the two?

INT's are up for sure....

Originally posted by Novus
You're asking the wrong question.

The real question is... when it comes to morale-turnover spirals, why does there seem to be no difference whether a player has 88 Confidence or 28 Confidence? Coz back in the day when these spirals were commonplace, it didn't seem to matter at all how much Confidence you had -- which is what made the "fix ur builds" crowd so asinine in that debate. For people who felt that builds mattered so much, they sure couldn't be bothered to actually look at any actual builds.

I'll bet that if you go look at some interceptions for some rookie dots and pro dots and compare, I'm sure you see the scale of how much morale loss is incurred is very different for a dot with 88 confidence than that of one with 28. I say scale, because it's not going to be the same every play. No doubt an RNG in there, it's how Bort thinks, now if you knew what he considers a high confidence you could estimate those ranges of fluctuation that can be expected.

Originally posted by Dr. E
I'll bet that if you go look at some interceptions for some rookie dots and pro dots and compare, I'm sure you see the scale of how much morale loss is incurred is very different for a dot with 88 confidence than that of one with 28. I say scale, because it's not going to be the same every play. No doubt an RNG in there, it's how Bort thinks, now if you knew what he considers a high confidence you could estimate those ranges of fluctuation that can be expected.

But... but... that would constitute comment! And debate!

In theory I disagree with jdbolick on this. A player who is rattled is more likely to make additional mistakes. In GLB, I agree with him. In "real" football a HB that develops fumbilitis in a game is pulled. A QB who throws multiple picks will usually be benched. In GLB there is no such mechanism (and the starter/backup dynamic is much different) so the effect of previous turnovers should be removed or at the very least made less severe.

Originally posted by AirMcMVP
In theory I disagree with jdbolick on this. A player who is rattled is more likely to make additional mistakes. In GLB, I agree with him. In "real" football a HB that develops fumbilitis in a game is pulled. A QB who throws multiple picks will usually be benched. In GLB there is no such mechanism (and the starter/backup dynamic is much different) so the effect of previous turnovers should be removed or at the very least made less severe.

This.

For that reason alone.

Also, correct me if I am wrong. QBs with more confidence, is "More Confident in His Throws". Therefore, more apt to throw into tight coverage. Which plays in to the INT builds.

So, I wonder if too much confidence is the problem.

Originally posted by Staz
Why do you think teams try to get pressure on QBs, to hit them when they can, and try to get inside some QBs heads? Because that rattles them, and they make poor decisions.
That's a myth. All quarterbacks struggle with pressure, including greats like Tom Brady. http://blog.masslive.com/patriots/2013/05/were_tom_bradys_struggles_agai.html

Originally posted by
I know you're a smart man, but I don't understand how you think a player who gets rattled, shaken, and just doesn't have his head in the game isn't more likely to make a mistake.
You covered it at the start of the sentence. An NFL quarterback prone to interceptions is always prone to interceptions, he doesn't suddenly become that way if he has one early in a game.

Originally posted by
High confidence players get rattled less. Some players take mistakes personally and "step up to the plate". Some shrug it off. Low confidence guys get frustrated. They try to "make up for it". They hear footsteps. They force things and often lead to more mistakes.
Again, this is a myth. There are numerous statistical studies showing that the notion of "clutch" or "confident" performance isn't real. Derek Jeter has roughly the same batting average in "clutch" situations as he does in any other, people just think he's "clutch" because he's a good hitter in general and they remember the successes in key moments.


Originally posted by Novus
jd, if you're not looking for debate or even comment, quit debating and commenting.
Why? Do you go into a classroom and demand that the teacher yield the floor to students? Again, I've already covered this issue four years ago. I know what happens in real life, I know what's happening in the sim, and I know what needs to be fixed. You guys bringing up points I proved wrong four years ago is an unnecessary annoyance.

Originally posted by
Instead of indulging in your pathological need to disagree with me about something, anything
I seriously laughed out loud when I read this. Dude, you're not even close to being relevant enough for me to want to disagree or agree with you. The fact that we disagree has more to do with be being smart and you not. The idea that I would ever choose to disagree with you is laughable. My statements are based on my own judgment.

Originally posted by Mob-6
Is it that the player is more likely to commit another turnover due to morale spiral or could it be that the defense is more likely to cause one due to a morale boost? Or even a combination of the two?
Both. Good point.


Originally posted by AirMcMVP
In "real" football a HB that develops fumbilitis in a game is pulled.
That's a myth. In the thread four years ago ketchfoop made the same claim, saying "Tiki Barber was pulled for fumbling 3 times in the 2002 game against the Eagles." I then pulled the box score to show that Tiki Barber was not pulled from that game and instead continued to play right up until the end. QBs generally don't get pulled either. The only times a HB or QB is removed is if they were already in competition for their job. If they were a clear cut starter, they don't get pulled unless the game is already so out of hand that the team gives up and wants to avoid injury.


Originally posted by Novus
But... but... that would constitute comment! And debate!
It constitutes nonsense that is a waste of time because it is yet again repeating the same shit from four years ago. Seriously, go read the thread I linked. It's like you guys are purposefully copying posts from back then. This is not a complicated issue. Turnover chance should always be determined by the builds involved, nothing more and nothing less.

Edit:I was a year late on that

To the jdbolick point about HBs not getting pulled because of fumbles


Ravens vs Jags a year or two ago. MJD and Ray Rice combined for, if i remember right, 6 or 7 fumbles. Niether was pulled. They are the clear cut "guy". Completely different scenario if someone is fighting for playing time.

Originally posted by jdbolick
Why? Do you go into a classroom and demand that the teacher yield the floor to students?

I seriously laughed out loud when I read this.

No, I don't go into a classroom and demand that the teacher yield the floor to students.

However, you're not a teacher, I'm not a student, this ain't no classroom.

Go fuck yourself with a splintered ruler, "teacher."

Originally posted by BadgerPhil
Also, correct me if I am wrong. QBs with more confidence, is "More Confident in His Throws". Therefore, more apt to throw into tight coverage. Which plays in to the INT builds.

So, I wonder if too much confidence is the problem.



Huh. That would explain a lot, actually.

Originally posted by jdbolick
Originally posted by Novus

I don't think anything's changed in the sim to make INTs more likely
They did. INT builds have always been around, they just weren't always effective. And as noted, I love that they work now. The problem is that I explained four years ago what fix Bort needed to make to prevent turnover cascades.

Originally posted by

While I agree with you on the problem, I don't agree with you on the solution. Committing a turnover should make it more likely to commit another one.
No, committing a turnover absolutely shouldn't make you more likely to have another. That's not only completely unrealistic, but it's exactly what is causing the problem. The only thing that will ever fix turnover cascades definitively is to make all turnovers always dependent just on the builds involved.

Again:
Originally posted by jdbolick

I'm not really looking for a debate or even comment here. None of you have any ideas that I haven't already considered, and I've already explained what is happening.



You have Obviously never watched Tony Romo Play...And I am a Cowboys fan