Warrior General Games

Originally posted by j10er
Originally posted by bigg987

what attributes are in the mechanics of Forcing a Fumble? is this the reason he is aiming for absurdly high tackling?

Tackling is the number one factor in forcing fumbles, per Bort.

But that's not even close to the reason why high Tackling is worthwhile.


the number factor, "as per bort", but what others go into it... has anyone seen an equation for it anywhere?

Originally posted by whatje
Originally posted by j10er

Originally posted by whatje


intentionally 74-capping tackling is absurdly useless at any position.

Please, explain why.

because its a waste of sp. its never going to completely eliminate missed tackles and there are other attributes that every position needs more than the difference between 3-5 missed tackles and 0.

So you're assuming the Tackling attribute is only for tackling?


Originally posted by bigg987
Originally posted by j10er

Originally posted by bigg987


what attributes are in the mechanics of Forcing a Fumble? is this the reason he is aiming for absurdly high tackling?

Tackling is the number one factor in forcing fumbles, per Bort.

But that's not even close to the reason why high Tackling is worthwhile.


the number factor, "as per bort", but what others go into it... has anyone seen an equation for it anywhere?




When a defender attempts a tackle, he gets a tackle roll and a forced fumble roll. Depending on how good the tackle is (and if it's successful) will determine if the FF roll was good enough.

So, what goes into it? Everything.

Tackling, strength, agility, speed at impact, and vision. And, of course, these are in constant flux depending on stamina, confidence and the flow of the game. And then there are modifiers... +FF%, Monster Hit, Big Hit, etc.

And this is all versus the ball-carrier's ability to hold on to the ball, to avoid tackles, to break tackles, modifiers, etc.

Damn complicated

I am sure to get put in my place here. I am certain. I realize this is about the best lvl 30ish NT however I could not help but notice all the stat debating and what not. The thing is my DT is lvl 10 with 73 agility(65 of it being natural). So truth be told even at my lvl my bars are still relatively light in color compared to other dt's my lvl. Just thought I'd pop in here randomly and give my two cents which is basicaly nothing given the fact that I am merely just throwing out my own personal stats.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=612123

Originally posted by j10er
Originally posted by whatje

Originally posted by j10er

Originally posted by whatje

intentionally 74-capping tackling is absurdly useless at any position.
Please, explain why.
because its a waste of sp. its never going to completely eliminate missed tackles and there are other attributes that every position needs more than the difference between 3-5 missed tackles and 0.
So you're assuming the Tackling attribute is only for tackling?


yes. but even if its not, the scenario you just threw out is a lot of evidence why pushing tackling that high is wasteful because unlike tackling, strength, agility, speed, vision, etc. all have other uses.

Here is my DT http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=884171. Build is open. He was one of my first characters so his build isn't as good as it could be or as good as some of the people who have posted links to their guys. I am finally done with Str/Spd/Agi and will be getting Vision and Tackling up next. I will eventually get his SAs but saving them for last.

Im not getting a lot of playing time this season and my guy is severely out leveled so looking forward to next season to try and find a more even playing field for him.

Also I agree with what a few have said. I believe tackling is important, but in the early stages of player development Str and Agi are king for a DT and NT. If I were building a pure NT like this thread started off talking about then I could possibly see taking tackling to 61 or 68 before you took speed, but still not sure. I do like some speed on defense at every position.

Originally posted by whatje
Originally posted by j10er

Originally posted by whatje


Originally posted by j10er


Originally posted by whatje


intentionally 74-capping tackling is absurdly useless at any position.
Please, explain why.
because its a waste of sp. its never going to completely eliminate missed tackles and there are other attributes that every position needs more than the difference between 3-5 missed tackles and 0.
So you're assuming the Tackling attribute is only for tackling?


yes. but even if its not, the scenario you just threw out is a lot of evidence why pushing tackling that high is wasteful because unlike tackling, strength, agility, speed, vision, etc. all have other uses.

Tackling does a heck of a lot more than help you tackle.

Quick question - what does Carrying do?

Originally posted by j10er


Tackling does a heck of a lot more than help you tackle.

Quick question - what does Carrying do?

Name some things tackling helps you with besides forcing fumbles slightly, and making tackles. ooooooo

name some things carrying help you with besides holding on to the ball and using your juke moves better...ooooooooooo

tackling and carrying are nothing by themselves.

Originally posted by El Tejano
How's mine?

http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=1223574

Would not mind a few more sacks....

win for the manster picture

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by j10er



Tackling does a heck of a lot more than help you tackle.

Quick question - what does Carrying do?

Name some things tackling helps you with besides forcing fumbles slightly, and making tackles. ooooooo

name some things carrying help you with besides holding on to the ball and using your juke moves better...ooooooooooo

tackling and carrying are nothing by themselves.


Carrying = Preventing fumbles, breaking tackles, avoiding tackles, increase chance to trigger SAs, securing the ball after a catch. All of these are confirmed by Bort. There are a few other theories out there, such as changing directions, finding holes, getting through the line, etc. Most coincide with what we already know of carrying - mainly, avoiding tackles.

Tackling = Making a tackle, forcing fumbles, increases tackling radius, increases chance to perform a tackle coming off a block and while being blocked, decreases chance of a broken tackle and/or being faked/juked, increases chance to shed block, increases ability to knock a pass loose (KL), increases chance to trigger SAs. The only one of those that hasn't been confirmed is the last, but if Carrying does it, it certainly make sense that Tackling does it. And, again, there are a number of other theories out there, such as getting back up and choosing correct angles.

Originally posted by j10er
Originally posted by UnderDogs

Originally posted by j10er




Tackling does a heck of a lot more than help you tackle.

Quick question - what does Carrying do?

Name some things tackling helps you with besides forcing fumbles slightly, and making tackles. ooooooo

name some things carrying help you with besides holding on to the ball and using your juke moves better...ooooooooooo

tackling and carrying are nothing by themselves.


Carrying = Preventing fumbles, breaking tackles, avoiding tackles, increase chance to trigger SAs, securing the ball after a catch. All of these are confirmed by Bort. There are a few other theories out there, such as changing directions, finding holes, getting through the line, etc. Most coincide with what we already know of carrying - mainly, avoiding tackles.

Tackling = Making a tackle, forcing fumbles, increases tackling radius, increases chance to perform a tackle coming off a block and while being blocked, decreases chance of a broken tackle and/or being faked/juked, increases chance to shed block, increases ability to knock a pass loose (KL), increases chance to trigger SAs. The only one of those that hasn't been confirmed is the last, but if Carrying does it, it certainly make sense that Tackling does it. And, again, there are a number of other theories out there, such as getting back up and choosing correct angles.

Even if the things you listed weren't pretty much all the same things for each one(especially carrying), without speed agility vision and str, they are still both meaningless

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by j10er

Originally posted by UnderDogs


Originally posted by j10er





Tackling does a heck of a lot more than help you tackle.

Quick question - what does Carrying do?

Name some things tackling helps you with besides forcing fumbles slightly, and making tackles. ooooooo

name some things carrying help you with besides holding on to the ball and using your juke moves better...ooooooooooo

tackling and carrying are nothing by themselves.


Carrying = Preventing fumbles, breaking tackles, avoiding tackles, increase chance to trigger SAs, securing the ball after a catch. All of these are confirmed by Bort. There are a few other theories out there, such as changing directions, finding holes, getting through the line, etc. Most coincide with what we already know of carrying - mainly, avoiding tackles.

Tackling = Making a tackle, forcing fumbles, increases tackling radius, increases chance to perform a tackle coming off a block and while being blocked, decreases chance of a broken tackle and/or being faked/juked, increases chance to shed block, increases ability to knock a pass loose (KL), increases chance to trigger SAs. The only one of those that hasn't been confirmed is the last, but if Carrying does it, it certainly make sense that Tackling does it. And, again, there are a number of other theories out there, such as getting back up and choosing correct angles.

Even if the things you listed weren't pretty much all the same things for each one(especially carrying), without speed agility vision and str, they are still both meaningless

That might be, quite honestly, the dumbest argument I've ever seen on the boards.

No shit, Sherlock. A quadriplegic with a 90 in Carrying will still be a quadriplegic.

We were having a discussion about what Tackling does, and you come in here talking about Speed, Agility, Vision and Strength. Where is the sense in that???

Originally posted by j10er

That might be, quite honestly, the dumbest argument I've ever seen on the boards.

No shit, Sherlock. A quadriplegic with a 90 in Carrying will still be a quadriplegic.

We were having a discussion about what Tackling does, and you come in here talking about Speed, Agility, Vision and Strength. Where is the sense in that???

It makes just as much sense as you naming the same thing over and over except different ways.

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by j10er


That might be, quite honestly, the dumbest argument I've ever seen on the boards.

No shit, Sherlock. A quadriplegic with a 90 in Carrying will still be a quadriplegic.

We were having a discussion about what Tackling does, and you come in here talking about Speed, Agility, Vision and Strength. Where is the sense in that???

It makes just as much sense as you naming the same thing over and over except different ways.

Show me two things I mentioned that are the same.

the point isn't that tackling doesn't do anything, it's that other attributes are many times more valuable. it's not a stupid argument at all to say high tackling and low other stats is a bad combination because high tackling necessarily implies lower speed, agility, str, etc.

tackling helps with tackling, and to an extent forcing fumbles i guess? even if that's true (which i am not certain of and don't really care to hear why i should be certain of it), strength also helps with forcing fumbles and also helps with a lot of other things. i have never heard or seen any evidence from anyone that tackling helps a) prevent you from being susceptible to fakes (see: vision), b) increases chances to shed block (see: str, agi, SAs), c) increases ability to knock passes loose (see: strength, although i'm not sure how this is a useful skill for d-lineman anyway), or d) increases chances to fire SAs (carrying doesn't do this either from anything that i've seen or heard).