Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Prince Envy
thats the game... bringing in good players... what part of that dont u guys understand ... thats he nature of the game ...

Which is fine as long as their are limitations that allow parity. People want a level playing field (or as close to one as possible). Games are about competition and competition is about challenge... without a challenge, what's the point? An ego boost maybe?

If GLB chooses not to address issues, be vocal in a way that they have to listen... with your business. In the real world, if you're playing for free, you have no say. Or continue to pay for a service that you're unhappy with. I was contemplating buying a few more flex points, but I'll hold off until I see how GLB handles these issues.

Originally posted by shacky21
Originally posted by Sinyen

Originally posted by shacky21


Originally posted by Lef Grebo



Actually I think the owner was never punished. He claimed innocense and was given the benefit of the doubt.

Also, I asm not sure what was proposed by Billsman was colluding in order to beat them ( although there is nothing wrong with that. Teams trade game films and notes all the time in real life ) but he is trying to organize a protest with the game admins.

I could be wrong tho.


The team owner, new or old, trading away these 'banned' players is not cheating. if they were CPU or inactive, nobody would be saying anything...there is no difference...and it is not unethical. People who say that live in glass houses because i'm sure they have dealt or tried to deal CPU and/or inactive players.


That's a very specific, unbelievably incorrect statement that in my estimate is only made by someone that is open to the idea of doing something as unethical as trading away banned players. Just because you're lowlife enough to think it's ok to trade banned/cpu/inactive players surely doesn't mean the rest of the world is. On the contrary, most of us find it appalling and yes, quite unethical.

that is BS and you know it. and calling me a lowlife does alot to show your maturity and that having a debate with you is pretty much worthless. None the less, I'll respond and state that I find it very hard to believe you have never tried to trade an inactive player or a cpu player. I have been in this game now for a little over a month I think, and have seen MANY offers of such. Now you can respond and say 'just because some are unethical, doesn't mean we all are' all you want. It is not unethical...it states clear as day 'inactive', 'cpu', and 'banned'. If someone sees that and agrees to a deal anyway, how is that unethical??? And if someone doesn't see it, than shame on them for not doing their homework, nothing..I repeat nothing..is hidden.

Have you ever had an ethics course? I think the reason you find it appalling is because to do so benefits your current situation in this matter, and that behavior is well...unethical. Time for a mirror check.

You obviously don't understand the meaning of the word unethical. Legal <> Unethical, braniac. What he did was legal, but not moral, hence by definition, unethical. Legal doesn't make it "right".

Originally posted by Warlock

Which is fine as long as their are limitations that allow parity. People want a level playing field (or as close to one as possible). Games are about competition and competition is about challenge... without a challenge, what's the point? An ego boost maybe?

If GLB chooses not to address issues, be vocal in a way that they have to listen... with your business. In the real world, if you're playing for free, you have no say. Or continue to pay for a service that you're unhappy with. I was contemplating buying a few more flex points, but I'll hold off until I see how GLB handles these issues.
agreed

im fine living with the way it is right now because its beta, they are still learning, so are the members, and i think it will work itself out pretty soon. i would be surprised if they let contracts expire on the eve of the playoffs again like this

but i too am saving my money to see what happens. my interest almost went empty over the chattanooga affair, but it came back when the admins took action. we will see if they find a solution to this legal but highly unsavory act of loading up before playoff time. if not, my interest will plummet and i will be out as well

Originally posted by shacky21
Originally posted by Lef Grebo

Actually I think the owner was never punished. He claimed innocense and was given the benefit of the doubt.

Also, I asm not sure what was proposed by Billsman was colluding in order to beat them ( although there is nothing wrong with that. Teams trade game films and notes all the time in real life ) but he is trying to organize a protest with the game admins.

I could be wrong tho.

fair, but moot. even if the team owner did not lose the team, he did lose the owners of many of his players, hence they can no longer spend their skill pts and upgrade. The admins thought that the players should remain....bitch to them if you have issue is all i'm saying.

The team owner, new or old, trading away these 'banned' players is not cheating. if they were CPU or inactive, nobody would be saying anything...there is no difference...and it is not unethical. People who say that live in glass houses because i'm sure they have dealt or tried to deal CPU and/or inactive players.

And if bills is saying 'get together and game plan' on a way to address the admins, that is not collusion, if he is saying as I read 'get together and game plan' strategies to beat the team on the field, that is collusion though i don't think it would be very effective the way the game is set up.

i never said it was cheating. what has been said is the trading of a banned player, even in consideration of buyer beware, is unsportsmanlike. what was also said was that the punishment has not fit the crimes. the cheating that occurred in richmonds case was whatever got them banned in the first place. their players should have been dropped from the roster immediately.

Originally posted by shacky21
also, how do you know who he's traded and what he's brought in for this banned talent??? Awful presumptuous and self serving to make a statement of cheating and poor ethics when you have no idea. I'm sure he's had to shop these guys real hard to trade them, maybe as I said he dealt them to teams that have poorer players and thought the banned players were an upgrade, dealt cash for them and knew they were banned?? Have you investigated that far, or just jumped to 'ass'umptions??

Maybe all these 'ringers' were acquired through FA? Maybe some of you bid on them and lost? I know he is paying alot for them...who cares, he'll have to pay the price at some point. They are only one year deals, and maybe his plan is to get some cheap cash for those banned players...if I had a shotty team and felt they could help me I'd deal for cash for them. Heck, maybe I should look and see who's available!

Anyhow, I have no stake in the race...i'm just reading the forum and getting tired of the whining from the same parties. If it were legit, like the cheatanooga issue then I'd support it, but this is not legit and as far I can see they are doing no wrong.

perhaps you also were not aware that several of us have kept track of this guys trade dealings by paying attention to how he was advertising on the forums. where you aware that richmonds owner posted an offering of these banned players and presented them as "active players" that were second string and so he was just trying to get them playing time? that was a bald faced lie. but of course you are ok with this because as you have said previously it is up to the buyer to be better than the liar, to watch their own ass in order to prevent being jipped.

Originally posted by shacky21
Originally posted by Sinyen

Originally posted by shacky21


Originally posted by Lef Grebo



Actually I think the owner was never punished. He claimed innocense and was given the benefit of the doubt.

Also, I asm not sure what was proposed by Billsman was colluding in order to beat them ( although there is nothing wrong with that. Teams trade game films and notes all the time in real life ) but he is trying to organize a protest with the game admins.

I could be wrong tho.


The team owner, new or old, trading away these 'banned' players is not cheating. if they were CPU or inactive, nobody would be saying anything...there is no difference...and it is not unethical. People who say that live in glass houses because i'm sure they have dealt or tried to deal CPU and/or inactive players.


That's a very specific, unbelievably incorrect statement that in my estimate is only made by someone that is open to the idea of doing something as unethical as trading away banned players. Just because you're lowlife enough to think it's ok to trade banned/cpu/inactive players surely doesn't mean the rest of the world is. On the contrary, most of us find it appalling and yes, quite unethical.

that is BS and you know it. and calling me a lowlife does alot to show your maturity and that having a debate with you is pretty much worthless. None the less, I'll respond and state that I find it very hard to believe you have never tried to trade an inactive player or a cpu player. I have been in this game now for a little over a month I think, and have seen MANY offers of such. Now you can respond and say 'just because some are unethical, doesn't mean we all are' all you want. It is not unethical...it states clear as day 'inactive', 'cpu', and 'banned'. If someone sees that and agrees to a deal anyway, how is that unethical??? And if someone doesn't see it, than shame on them for not doing their homework, nothing..I repeat nothing..is hidden.

Have you ever had an ethics course? I think the reason you find it appalling is because to do so benefits your current situation in this matter, and that behavior is well...unethical. Time for a mirror check.

for someone whose honor is presented as being so bulletproof we sure are sensitive arent we. while something may state inactive cpu or banned if the owner is posting "active players for trade" and is in fact trading banned players are you ok with that too?

Originally posted by SAVAGE OPS
Originally posted by Billsrgreat

I believe this discussion can be put to rest until tonight. The Speed play the Mole Rats.

This will be a true test to see how much chemistry comes into play 15 vs. 89
(chemistry)

It will also be a good test to see whether the wits of 1 beat out the wits of 6 GM's
(gameplanning)


I have my fake money on the Mole rats winning by 2 1/2 since I believe the MoleRats have the Speed dominated in Gameplanning, and Chemistry



Well everyone else is out of town, so I guess it's 1 Wit vs. 1 Wit
I just hope I don't come out looking like a Nit Wit, lol

Good Win for you.

Your next won't be so easy

Originally posted by General Terms
Originally posted by shacky21

also, how do you know who he's traded and what he's brought in for this banned talent??? Awful presumptuous and self serving to make a statement of cheating and poor ethics when you have no idea. I'm sure he's had to shop these guys real hard to trade them, maybe as I said he dealt them to teams that have poorer players and thought the banned players were an upgrade, dealt cash for them and knew they were banned?? Have you investigated that far, or just jumped to 'ass'umptions??

Maybe all these 'ringers' were acquired through FA? Maybe some of you bid on them and lost? I know he is paying alot for them...who cares, he'll have to pay the price at some point. They are only one year deals, and maybe his plan is to get some cheap cash for those banned players...if I had a shotty team and felt they could help me I'd deal for cash for them. Heck, maybe I should look and see who's available!

Anyhow, I have no stake in the race...i'm just reading the forum and getting tired of the whining from the same parties. If it were legit, like the cheatanooga issue then I'd support it, but this is not legit and as far I can see they are doing no wrong.

perhaps you also were not aware that several of us have kept track of this guys trade dealings by paying attention to how he was advertising on the forums. where you aware that richmonds owner posted an offering of these banned players and presented them as "active players" that were second string and so he was just trying to get them playing time? that was a bald faced lie. but of course you are ok with this because as you have said previously it is up to the buyer to be better than the liar, to watch their own ass in order to prevent being jipped.

I agree he did stretch the truth because in that group of players there were in fact active players along with the banned ones.

If it were 'unethical' to try to get the better end of a trade we'd all be guilty. It is buyer beware, and again...trading banned players is no different than trading inactive and cpu players. Everything is disclosed and available...there's nothing hiding to those who do their due diligence and look. I disagree it is unsportsmanlike, and again ask you to post any of these trades you've been referring to. Are we complaining about nothing, or did he in fact make any significant trades of these players?

The bigger issue most of you seem to have is that he's signed high lvl players mid season. That complaint is unethical because I highly doubt any of you would not put an offer into a high lvl player if he were on the market and you thought you could obtain him. Level 18 LB PM's you and says he wants to get onto a team that is close to winning and really needs him. You, really needing him are going to say no??? Get real and stop BS to support your arguements is all i'm saying.

The only unsportsmanlike thing happening is the amount of cash he's throwing around, and it is only unsportsmanlike if he doesn't hang around to rebuild his team after the cash well is dry.

Originally posted by shacky21


Again, I don't know what cheating took place and why the players remained...that is the avenue you guys should be fighting....not attacking the owner of the speed for trading his players.

again my point has been the punishment did not fit the crime. speed is reaping the rewards that the banned players provided at other teams/players expense, perhaps even your team shacky21. this complaint i level squarely at the admins who told me they dealt with it and it didnt matter because they felt the speed would end up losing. but in fact they did not leading me back to the original problem, their reaping the rewards of the banned players.

the second problem i have is the speed owner representing the banned players as "active players just looking to start" (http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=238924) and using this lie to aid in trading away garbage. you may think that its purely the buyers responsibility but there is no excuse for the dishonesty. besides lets face it, there are some easily fooled / mentally challenged folks out there. should we simply pluck dollars from the blind pan handler simply because he didnt have the forethought to put his hand over his cup? again, just because you can take advantage of people doesnt mean you should. if you think the might makes right policy or in the case the clever makes right policy trumps honesty then perhaps you should retake that ethics class you referred to.

ps. why do you need to go to a college course to learn how to be a good man anyway? i always thought you should learn that from your family.

Originally posted by shacky21
Originally posted by cavalier

Shacky, did you see this post by Yard Dog earlier in the eastern playoff picture thread? Take a look at the links that he provided, I think they are the reason why people think the Speed owner is unethical.


Originally posted by Yard Dog


Originally posted by sabresandkane



haha, did you notice that the Scorgasms came under new ownership today and are now the 'Fishless'

Yea and Richmond Speed was able to get rid of several of the banned boys and add a lot of talent??

Doing the math, they roughly pay out 124,750 a day for contracts... times that by 14 pay days left.... = 1,746,500 for salaries to pay out yet. They only have 1,151,712 currently. So they are going to need some nice concession sales and home field advantage in the playoffs to pay these beefy salaries.

I don't know where these Richmond guys found all these players, but he's been real busy. WOW signed about 38 high leveled players in the last few days.

Edit: Just gonna add a few links that I am coming across...
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=239258
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=248426
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=238924





We don't have enough information to persecute the guy at this time. l.


you know what i heard? i heard that shacky21 is a communist, he hates whales, and enjoys littering!

again, and my last post on the subject. i have no issue with anyone arguing about the punishment not fitting the crime. i also have no issue if people think the banned players should be removed. that is opinion and should be taken up with the admins. I don't know the situations involving that cheating and won't comment on it. the admins felt the players should remain, and I don't see any reason why they can't be dealt, just as inactive and/or cpu players are, they are commodities.

I agree with you that he stretched the truth, and if they were all banned players i'd say he did blatantly lie. they weren't however all banned players in his post so that was a stretch of the truth and unsportsmanlike. However, it was very minor...and similar to someone posting 'great QB available' when they are offering a lvl 2 QB. It happens everyday....and is rediculous but minor. Taking advantage of a blind panhandler analogy really doesn't fit here, and is a huge reach. Again, everything is disclosed if you look and ethically, that is all that is required in a business transaction.

Although it appears you may not be beating on the speed owner and calling him a cheat, there definetly have been those who were. With the weekly name calling attacks going on in this forum, it's about straw drawing time to determine who's up for this weeks attacks isn't it??? I really seems from an outsiders viewpoint, that people are more upset that they didn't get the high level players, or didn't try to and now have a lesser chance of winning. Only one team can win it all guys....

Good luck with this one, should be interesting to see how it all shakes out. I've had enough of it...maybe i'll chime in to defend next weeks 'cheater'.

Originally posted by shacky21
Originally posted by General Terms

Originally posted by shacky21


also, how do you know who he's traded and what he's brought in for this banned talent??? Awful presumptuous and self serving to make a statement of cheating and poor ethics when you have no idea. I'm sure he's had to shop these guys real hard to trade them, maybe as I said he dealt them to teams that have poorer players and thought the banned players were an upgrade, dealt cash for them and knew they were banned?? Have you investigated that far, or just jumped to 'ass'umptions??

Maybe all these 'ringers' were acquired through FA? Maybe some of you bid on them and lost? I know he is paying alot for them...who cares, he'll have to pay the price at some point. They are only one year deals, and maybe his plan is to get some cheap cash for those banned players...if I had a shotty team and felt they could help me I'd deal for cash for them. Heck, maybe I should look and see who's available!

Anyhow, I have no stake in the race...i'm just reading the forum and getting tired of the whining from the same parties. If it were legit, like the cheatanooga issue then I'd support it, but this is not legit and as far I can see they are doing no wrong.

perhaps you also were not aware that several of us have kept track of this guys trade dealings by paying attention to how he was advertising on the forums. where you aware that richmonds owner posted an offering of these banned players and presented them as "active players" that were second string and so he was just trying to get them playing time? that was a bald faced lie. but of course you are ok with this because as you have said previously it is up to the buyer to be better than the liar, to watch their own ass in order to prevent being jipped.

I agree he did stretch the truth because in that group of players there were in fact active players along with the banned ones.

If it were 'unethical' to try to get the better end of a trade we'd all be guilty. It is buyer beware, and again...trading banned players is no different than trading inactive and cpu players. Everything is disclosed and available...there's nothing hiding to those who do their due diligence and look. I disagree it is unsportsmanlike, and again ask you to post any of these trades you've been referring to. Are we complaining about nothing, or did he in fact make any significant trades of these players?

The bigger issue most of you seem to have is that he's signed high lvl players mid season. That complaint is unethical because I highly doubt any of you would not put an offer into a high lvl player if he were on the market and you thought you could obtain him. Level 18 LB PM's you and says he wants to get onto a team that is close to winning and really needs him. You, really needing him are going to say no??? Get real and stop BS to support your arguements is all i'm saying.

The only unsportsmanlike thing happening is the amount of cash he's throwing around, and it is only unsportsmanlike if he doesn't hang around to rebuild his team after the cash well is dry.

pay attention to whom the opinions belong too. i have not said a word about the excessive contracts. i think it is a bit unfair to sign a guy to a gagillion dollar contract only to go bankrupt next week but in this situation you and i agree, thats the players fault for signing the contract.

what i disagree with is that speed has been allowed to get this far at all even though they initially did something wrong enough to get banned in the first place (obviously cheating of some sort to get banned) now before you say prove the owner had anything to do with it let me stop you, all i have to do is point to two things: 1) a previous poster hit it right on the head when he said that 'no way an owner ACCIDENTALLY signs 40 players who end up getting banned. and 2) any owner who misrepresents banned players as active looking for playing time loses any benefit of the doubt in my book.

my bottom line is this - there is a saying, "cheaters never prosper". unfortunately in glb they are allowed to. richmond started the season as cheaters and while the owner may not be doing it presently he is still prospering. the admins never should have allowed this.

Originally posted by shacky21


With the weekly name calling attacks going on in this forum, it's about straw drawing time to determine who's up for this weeks attacks isn't it???


GOOD IDEA. Well looks like you got the short straw shaky21. Allright so lets start things off with some old fashion momma jokes.

Shaky's momma so...

I'll Clarify something in regards to the Richmond Speed for those that don't know the exact details. When all this cheating came to light earlier in the season, the Richmond Speed had 56 human players. Of those 56, 52 got banned, but the owner did not. When my Memphis team played them, these were the circumstances. Tell me how you would feel if you lost 35-3 to a team composed of 93% banned players. Of the 52 that were banned there were 32 (all with different agents) that had been signed to 10 year contracts for minimum salaries.

yeah thats exactly the thing we are talking about. they hard wired the team from the start, with illegal multiple accounts, all cross linked for FP referral points, so that their players started out with high levels and inked to long term cheap contracts

then the owner, who doesnt get banned, turns around and leverages all that cheating into a good record and more players by offering high level banned players for trade and paying big contracts

part a was clearly cheating

part b is clearly unethical but not technically cheating

thats the crux of the entire argument

i think in hindsight the admins probably would handle this differently now. but it woulda been really hard to anticipate whats happened since that initial ruling

and based on todays results maybe it will be moot here shortly. if san diego can pull out a win next week the speed will only probably get one home game and will be bankrupt by next season at the latest. at least thats the way it looks right now