Warrior General Games

Any opinions on Dive 4 yads?

Seeing a lot of more builds with this jacked up than in the old PHB days


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Somewhere in the archives here is a thread where someone complained he never saw his dot dive four yards

Was anyone else surprised to look at the author of this thread and it not be yello1?

To answer the question, they all work. It just depends on the build. I think they are pretty nicely balanced.

Originally posted by KCScott
Any opinions on Dive 4 yads?

Seeing a lot of more builds with this jacked up than in the old PHB days


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Somewhere in the archives here is a thread where someone complained he never saw his dot dive four yards



I have a rushing FB with it who also has all the short yardage stacks. It can be very effective for rushing QBs as well as for power rushing FBs and HBs but of course there is an opportunity cost involved.

dive four yard,

My experience with PT on my FBs has been that a combination of carrying and strength works better. I don't like to build a back with less than 90 carrying and with the Veteran VA, i and I am finding its not hard to get Carrying, Strength, Agility, and Speed up, with 90s in the first three and mid to high 150s in Speed, PT, SP and Break Tackle gear.

Thankfully, after 25 seasons, TPat dropped some knowledge on me and even with a little RL problem that upset his training schedule, my first Power HB is going to meet my goals for him.

Next season, when it time to retire 50+ players, going to try several ideas I've had.

Originally posted by KCScott
Any opinions on Dive 4 yads?

Seeing a lot of more builds with this jacked up than in the old PHB days


----------

Somewhere in the archives here is a thread where someone complained he never saw his dot dive four yards



To be perfectly frank, from my tests, it has a bigger impact on elusive HBs than power HBs, frankly. When I raised it from 0 to 10 on my old elusive, the increase in YPC was visible in the situations where he was tackled by CBs and weak LBs or FSs. On a power HB just powering through the middle, it seems to be less noticeable. That's my honest opinion. I want to create a new elusive to test it further in the future.

Originally posted by Hagalaz
To be perfectly frank, from my tests, it has a bigger impact on elusive HBs than power HBs, frankly. When I raised it from 0 to 10 on my old elusive, the increase in YPC was visible in the situations where he was tackled by CBs and weak LBs or FSs. On a power HB just powering through the middle, it seems to be less noticeable. That's my honest opinion. I want to create a new elusive to test it further in the future.

which is why you build PB's with 140 speed and use them on pitches. ldo.

Originally posted by bhall43
which is why you build PB's with 140 speed and use them on pitches. ldo.

Yeah, come to think of it, this isn't elusive versus power, but outside versus inside rushing...

PT on a rQB in action - http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2263984&pbp_id=2785726

What's the opinion on surge these days?

It used to just have you out run blockers to the line

Originally posted by KCScott
What's the opinion on surge these days?

It used to just have you out run blockers to the line

I personally dont think its worth the investment.

Originally posted by whodey08
I personally dont think its worth the investment.

??? 5-6 Surge is WELL worth the investment, especially on slower backs and especially because momentum affects broken tackles. It works well for power backs, rushing QBs, rushing FBs and I honestly can't think of another SA where you get such consistent results only putting in 5-6 of an SA (i.e. add 5-6 Spin and Spin will not fire nearly as often as Surge fires with just 5-6).

Originally posted by tpaterniti
??? 5-6 Surge is WELL worth the investment, especially on slower backs and especially because momentum affects broken tackles. It works well for power backs, rushing QBs, rushing FBs and I honestly can't think of another SA where you get such consistent results only putting in 5-6 of an SA (i.e. add 5-6 Spin and Spin will not fire nearly as often as Surge fires with just 5-6).

I agree to some extent. I usually only see it fire maybe 1 to 2 times a game though. For me its just not worth it. Your talking 12 skill points for something that "may" fire a couple of times and even when it has fired I have seen the ball carrier still get tackled for a 1yd gain. I am sure there are the occasional run where it really helped. Just not worth the investment "for me".

Originally posted by tpaterniti
??? 5-6 Surge is WELL worth the investment, especially on slower backs and especially because momentum affects broken tackles. It works well for power backs, rushing QBs, rushing FBs and I honestly can't think of another SA where you get such consistent results only putting in 5-6 of an SA (i.e. add 5-6 Spin and Spin will not fire nearly as often as Surge fires with just 5-6).

I disagree. You are better off making the investment in another SA. Even on a pure between the tackles rusher I would rather see those 12-20 SPs go into a fake or break ability unless you are building a dive for yards/goalline/bruiser type that is only situational.

Again ??? 4 Surge costs 6 SPs, 5 costs 9, 6 costs 12. I have never seen a build with more than 6 because it fires so often with 6.

I put together this little stats analysis on my powerback's first 3 games this season:


Build: http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2367936
Stats:
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd314/tpaterniti/TempStats_zpsf7d1d3a8.png

I could do a huge sample size but it would probably just show the exact same trend you see here because that trend in the stats simply confirmed the impression I get every time I watch his games. And I must disagree with the 1 yd gain when it fires. I would say he averages pretty well beyond that when it fires.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265749&pbp_id=2737478 5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265749&pbp_id=2737717 2.5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265749&pbp_id=2738972 5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265749&pbp_id=2739041 4
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265749&pbp_id=2740277 7
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265748&pbp_id=2362387 6
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265748&pbp_id=2363246 8.5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265748&pbp_id=2363517 3
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265748&pbp_id=2364974 1.5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265864&pbp_id=1990750 3
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265864&pbp_id=1986262 6
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265864&pbp_id=1986806 4.5
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265864&pbp_id=1987969 1
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2265864&pbp_id=1989740 5

In fact he averaged 4.42 ypc when it fired and only 2 out of the 14 times (14%) did he gain fewer than 2 yards. Edit: looks like I missed one in the stats above - should read as firing 14 total times not 13. So that's 14 fires on 51 total runs (27% of the time) and 14 out of 38 inside runs (37% of the time).