Warrior General Games

Originally posted by tjsexy82
Originally posted by Ken1
There was a ton wrong with a line interaction that turned into a footrace. The changes that will be made will still not allow it to be a footrace, but instead give someone with the tools to shed a block a much better chance not to be immediately re-engaged (which is why block shedding hasn't worked well enough).

You always maintained people were saying that, but I don't remember hearing ANYONE who said speed should be the highest stat and I told you so back then. Everyone was saying that a pass-blocking OT should have agility and blocking as highest. You didn't get that then and apparently you don't get it now. Nobody said speed was most important. But at the same time, Bench Press isn't the main thing teams look at when drafting franchise LTs.

So is that why I see all the 200-240 pound OT's in the NFL? Oops, I don't. I see guys running 5.5 combine times considered top OT prospects (and yes, I did look that up)?

Actually, they were saying Agility should be their highest and the most extreme people said Speed the second highest. Not all the DE defenders, or not directly, but....

Basically, the argument was that 100 Speed DE's were stoppable-- just get 80 yourself, or the like. But that wasn't an acceptable solution, because linemen in real life are strong before fast.

Originally posted by Houston Oilers
they should at least make the DE able to hurry qb's pretty often like in real life.

Actually, due to SA's, QB's do BETTER when hurried than not.

lol.

Originally posted by PDO
Originally posted by Houston Oilers

they should at least make the DE able to hurry qb's pretty often like in real life.

Actually, due to SA's, QB's do BETTER when hurried than not.

lol.

False.

The key SA (Pocket Presence) only cuts down on the negative effect of a hurry.

Originally posted by PDO
How about this, lets all sit here and wait for Ken1 to find ONE POST where someone, not Ken1, says that OT's should have speed as their highest attribute and is serious.

One post Ken1.

C'mon, you can do it.

I'll even get off your case.

If EVERYONE was saying it, it should be really easy.

to be fair, forum search isn't working, only by username, so that's not really a fair challenge

but I agree he's unlikely to find it, and it CERTAINLY isn't true that everyone was saying it

Personally I am making a real pass-blocker for future seasons when hopefully things work properly. He is going to be 3cap + equip Blocking/Agility > 3cap Strength > 1cap Vision/Speed/Confidence

Originally posted by Ken1
Originally posted by tjsexy82

Originally posted by Ken1

There was a ton wrong with a line interaction that turned into a footrace. The changes that will be made will still not allow it to be a footrace, but instead give someone with the tools to shed a block a much better chance not to be immediately re-engaged (which is why block shedding hasn't worked well enough).

You always maintained people were saying that, but I don't remember hearing ANYONE who said speed should be the highest stat and I told you so back then. Everyone was saying that a pass-blocking OT should have agility and blocking as highest. You didn't get that then and apparently you don't get it now. Nobody said speed was most important. But at the same time, Bench Press isn't the main thing teams look at when drafting franchise LTs.

So is that why I see all the 200-240 pound OT's in the NFL? Oops, I don't. I see guys running 5.5 combine times considered top OT prospects (and yes, I did look that up)?

Actually, they were saying Agility should be their highest and the most extreme people said Speed the second highest. Not all the DE defenders, or not directly, but....

Basically, the argument was that 100 Speed DE's were stoppable-- just get 80 yourself, or the like. But that wasn't an acceptable solution, because linemen in real life are strong before fast.

Yes, and I remember quite an argument over whether a 5.5 combine time should be 48 speed or 25/30, but I guess that is of no matter now. You had a point in that it is silly to say OTs should just get as much speed as DEs. But I suspect that realistic pass blocker builds worked to stop speed DEs. You should ask Bukowski what really worked to stop OTs back in that time, because his team had the best OTs in the league. They shut PPP out a number of games back in the DE heyday. I suspect they weren't speed monsters.

Edit: PPP was more agility than speed, but he still had >80 speed so whatever Bukowski was doing would probably have worked across the board.

Originally posted by Ken1
Originally posted by tjsexy82

Originally posted by Ken1

There was a ton wrong with a line interaction that turned into a footrace. The changes that will be made will still not allow it to be a footrace, but instead give someone with the tools to shed a block a much better chance not to be immediately re-engaged (which is why block shedding hasn't worked well enough).

You always maintained people were saying that, but I don't remember hearing ANYONE who said speed should be the highest stat and I told you so back then. Everyone was saying that a pass-blocking OT should have agility and blocking as highest. You didn't get that then and apparently you don't get it now. Nobody said speed was most important. But at the same time, Bench Press isn't the main thing teams look at when drafting franchise LTs.

So is that why I see all the 200-240 pound OT's in the NFL? Oops, I don't. I see guys running 5.5 combine times considered top OT prospects (and yes, I did look that up)?

Actually, they were saying Agility should be their highest and the most extreme people said Speed the second highest. Not all the DE defenders, or not directly, but....

Basically, the argument was that 100 Speed DE's were stoppable-- just get 80 yourself, or the like. But that wasn't an acceptable solution, because linemen in real life are strong before fast.

Wrong.

http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?prospect_id=1316

Lets see here:

Things mentioned are his 40 yard dash (first!!), bench press, vertical jump, shuttle.

Originally posted by
NFL scouts love how Oher is able to control the line of scrimmage with his hulking physical frame and excellent footwork. Such a lethal combination makes it almost impossible for defensive linemen to get around his pass protection. Oher's quick feet also make him a strong run blocker (even though he is an even better pass blocker), as he is able to get to linebackers and neutralize their pursuit of the ball. He ran a 5.34 in the 40-yard-dash at the combine but knocked it down to 5.08 at Mississippi's pro day. Scouts also have to like Oher's durability; the big man has had no injury problems whatsoever at Ole Miss. He has been passed on the offensive linemen charts by Jason Smith, but Oher could be the second or third OT off the board and possibly a Top 10 selection in the 2009 draft.

Looks to me like if Oher was a GLB player he'd have 73 str/agility/blocking and 48 speed.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=1147708

strength and blocking already 3 capped
agility capped and working towards 2nd cap.
vision and confidence training to 33
then confidence stamina
then stamina and speed.

Originally posted by Ken1
Originally posted by tjsexy82

Originally posted by Ken1

There was a ton wrong with a line interaction that turned into a footrace. The changes that will be made will still not allow it to be a footrace, but instead give someone with the tools to shed a block a much better chance not to be immediately re-engaged (which is why block shedding hasn't worked well enough).

You always maintained people were saying that, but I don't remember hearing ANYONE who said speed should be the highest stat and I told you so back then. Everyone was saying that a pass-blocking OT should have agility and blocking as highest. You didn't get that then and apparently you don't get it now. Nobody said speed was most important. But at the same time, Bench Press isn't the main thing teams look at when drafting franchise LTs.

So is that why I see all the 200-240 pound OT's in the NFL? Oops, I don't. I see guys running 5.5 combine times considered top OT prospects (and yes, I did look that up)?

Actually, they were saying Agility should be their highest and the most extreme people said Speed the second highest. Not all the DE defenders, or not directly, but....

Basically, the argument was that 100 Speed DE's were stoppable-- just get 80 yourself, or the like. But that wasn't an acceptable solution, because linemen in real life are strong before fast.

Dunno where you're getting 5.50, but the top OT prospects just this year ran times like 5.17 or so

Originally posted by Maddoc
Originally posted by Ken1

Originally posted by tjsexy82


Originally posted by Ken1


There was a ton wrong with a line interaction that turned into a footrace. The changes that will be made will still not allow it to be a footrace, but instead give someone with the tools to shed a block a much better chance not to be immediately re-engaged (which is why block shedding hasn't worked well enough).

You always maintained people were saying that, but I don't remember hearing ANYONE who said speed should be the highest stat and I told you so back then. Everyone was saying that a pass-blocking OT should have agility and blocking as highest. You didn't get that then and apparently you don't get it now. Nobody said speed was most important. But at the same time, Bench Press isn't the main thing teams look at when drafting franchise LTs.

So is that why I see all the 200-240 pound OT's in the NFL? Oops, I don't. I see guys running 5.5 combine times considered top OT prospects (and yes, I did look that up)?

Actually, they were saying Agility should be their highest and the most extreme people said Speed the second highest. Not all the DE defenders, or not directly, but....

Basically, the argument was that 100 Speed DE's were stoppable-- just get 80 yourself, or the like. But that wasn't an acceptable solution, because linemen in real life are strong before fast.

Dunno where you're getting 5.50, but the top OT prospects just this year ran times like 5.17 or so

Oher ran a 5.32, and was clocked at a 5.08 while at 'Ole Miss.

http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1639

Double checking, I was slightly off

Of special note...
Originally posted by
At 6-6 and 315 pounds, Monroe has plenty of size, but it is his nimbleness that makes him special. He has some of the best feet anyone will see from an offensive lineman in college this year and he knows how to use them.

Sounds like p high Agility to me tbh

Originally posted by Maddoc
http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1639

Double checking, I was slightly off

You mean... OT's actually have to be able to move, they're not just lolfat?

BLASPHEMY!!!!!

I could keep going, but the fact is that saying "top OT prospects run a 5.50" is hilariously and demonstrably fallacious.

Originally posted by Maddoc
I could keep going, but the fact is that saying "top OT prospects run a 5.50" is hilariously and demonstrably fallacious.

Kind of like most of what he spews.

Coincidentally, he's gone MIA since stats got brought into the equation and his warped views don't even make sense to him....

Originally posted by Buckeyes33
i dont know why people are bitching now. all it is, is that DEs are more realistic. they aren't getting 74 sacks a season. the best are getting maybe 40 now against good teams in a good league.

You would know what you were talking about if you actually had a DE