I've been a mod elsewhere. No way in hell would I ever want to be a mod at this site unless Pallow figures out which direction he wants these forums to go. It's merely controlled anarchy.
Forum > Suggestions > Replace the Forum Ban System
spartan822
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Originally posted by jdbolick
And just look around the internet. SomethingAwful is one of the biggest online communities precisely because of the personalities involved, whereas I can't think of any heavily moderated site with large participation. Treating people like they're 12 suppresses activity and involvement instead of growing the customer base.
I've never heard of SomethingAwful, but I do know of at least one website (cbssports.com) with a large online "community" that is still growing. The moderation there is pretty strict, with some automatic language filters and lots of posts being removed if they're considered offensive. Although I don't think they're perma-banning as many users as they used to. ProFootballTalk is another one where you can't post anything negative or even remotely offensive (or sometimes even a differing opinion than the author's) without it being removed, and their userbase still seems to be growing. PFT seems to have a "blacklist" where once you're on it, it's difficult to post anything.
I agree with a lot of what Novus has said here. Inconsistent moderation is part of the problem. But I also realize that the mods have a rather difficult job to do and the moderation will never be perfected.
And just look around the internet. SomethingAwful is one of the biggest online communities precisely because of the personalities involved, whereas I can't think of any heavily moderated site with large participation. Treating people like they're 12 suppresses activity and involvement instead of growing the customer base.
I've never heard of SomethingAwful, but I do know of at least one website (cbssports.com) with a large online "community" that is still growing. The moderation there is pretty strict, with some automatic language filters and lots of posts being removed if they're considered offensive. Although I don't think they're perma-banning as many users as they used to. ProFootballTalk is another one where you can't post anything negative or even remotely offensive (or sometimes even a differing opinion than the author's) without it being removed, and their userbase still seems to be growing. PFT seems to have a "blacklist" where once you're on it, it's difficult to post anything.
I agree with a lot of what Novus has said here. Inconsistent moderation is part of the problem. But I also realize that the mods have a rather difficult job to do and the moderation will never be perfected.
Edited by spartan822 on Aug 21, 2012 10:42:06
mandyross
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Originally posted by jdbolick
It's inactivity that kills games, not rude behavior.
Creative rude behaviour is fun. That is sadly missing on these forums though.
Psychotically rude behaviour, and unoriginal rude behaviour are completely different. People who systematically insult a multitude of different users on these forums do not make things interesting for others. They are the ones who promote inactivity by driving everyone else away.
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice and going out of their way to target other users. They became inactive, and people had to go to a private forum to have intelligent and civil build advice discussions. It would be great if the general trolling in GLB was eliminated, so the hundreds of agents who post in that forum can migrate back into the GLB build advice forums.
It is extremely tiresome to read threads in GLB forums and the same delusional, boring, idiotic people spam out their token replies time after time. Now that is what promotes the inactivity.
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork.
A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
It's inactivity that kills games, not rude behavior.
Creative rude behaviour is fun. That is sadly missing on these forums though.
Psychotically rude behaviour, and unoriginal rude behaviour are completely different. People who systematically insult a multitude of different users on these forums do not make things interesting for others. They are the ones who promote inactivity by driving everyone else away.
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice and going out of their way to target other users. They became inactive, and people had to go to a private forum to have intelligent and civil build advice discussions. It would be great if the general trolling in GLB was eliminated, so the hundreds of agents who post in that forum can migrate back into the GLB build advice forums.
It is extremely tiresome to read threads in GLB forums and the same delusional, boring, idiotic people spam out their token replies time after time. Now that is what promotes the inactivity.
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork.
A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
Edited by mandyross on Aug 21, 2012 10:49:49
jdbolick
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Originally posted by mandyross
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice
Yeah ... uhm ... that has nothing to do with the subject.
Originally posted by
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork. A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
Considering that you're one of the worst offenders in FAQ, I'm surprised that you feel that way. In the recent energy thread you were repeatedly insulting to me while I kept my cool, but a lot of people like you can't be honest about your behavior, even with yourselves. Regardless, what you say is still wrong. People don't go inactive because someone else was rude to them. People go inactive when there isn't enough that appeals to them.
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice
Yeah ... uhm ... that has nothing to do with the subject.
Originally posted by
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork. A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
Considering that you're one of the worst offenders in FAQ, I'm surprised that you feel that way. In the recent energy thread you were repeatedly insulting to me while I kept my cool, but a lot of people like you can't be honest about your behavior, even with yourselves. Regardless, what you say is still wrong. People don't go inactive because someone else was rude to them. People go inactive when there isn't enough that appeals to them.
Edited by jdbolick on Aug 21, 2012 11:02:43
jdbolick
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Originally posted by spartan822
I've never heard of SomethingAwful, but I do know of at least one website (cbssports.com) with a large online "community" that is still growing. The moderation there is pretty strict, with some automatic language filters and lots of posts being removed if they're considered offensive. Although I don't think they're perma-banning as many users as they used to. ProFootballTalk is another one where you can't post anything negative or even remotely offensive (or sometimes even a differing opinion than the author's) without it being removed, and their userbase still seems to be growing. PFT seems to have a "blacklist" where once you're on it, it's difficult to post anything.
Those aren't forums, those are columns with comments sections.
I've never heard of SomethingAwful, but I do know of at least one website (cbssports.com) with a large online "community" that is still growing. The moderation there is pretty strict, with some automatic language filters and lots of posts being removed if they're considered offensive. Although I don't think they're perma-banning as many users as they used to. ProFootballTalk is another one where you can't post anything negative or even remotely offensive (or sometimes even a differing opinion than the author's) without it being removed, and their userbase still seems to be growing. PFT seems to have a "blacklist" where once you're on it, it's difficult to post anything.
Those aren't forums, those are columns with comments sections.
MadCow420
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Originally posted by Dadd
Originally posted by Novus
Dadd, I love ya, man, but if you're ignoring rules violations, you're part of the problem.
Either you need to start enforcing those rules, or those rules need to be removed.
Ignored = just cuz someone is doing something I don't personally care for doesn't mean I take action
How i read it
magic mike reported one of Dadd's own posts, dadd lol'd and ignored it
Originally posted by Novus
Dadd, I love ya, man, but if you're ignoring rules violations, you're part of the problem.
Either you need to start enforcing those rules, or those rules need to be removed.
Ignored = just cuz someone is doing something I don't personally care for doesn't mean I take action
How i read it
magic mike reported one of Dadd's own posts, dadd lol'd and ignored it
Novus
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Originally posted by Dadd
Originally posted by Novus
Dadd, I love ya, man, but if you're ignoring rules violations, you're part of the problem.
Either you need to start enforcing those rules, or those rules need to be removed.
Ignored = just cuz someone is doing something I don't personally care for doesn't mean I take action
Then, I'm sorry, Dadd, but you're still part of the problem.
You should be enforcing the rules as written. Whether or not you personally care for something or not shouldn't enter the equation.
Personally, I don't mind profanity. Curse away. But if I were a moderator on a site that banned profanity, I'd enforce that ban -- because it would be my JOB to enforce that ban.
Your own personal opinion of forum behavior should not enter the equation at all. And unfortunately, that's a huge problem with this moderating staff.
Things you have no problem with are considered 7-day ban offenses by other mods. That's inconsistent. That's a problem.
I can post a profanity-laced opinionated tirade, a violation of the forum rules on its face, but because 80% of the mods happen to agree with my opinion, they let it slide. That's a problem. Then one more mod can read it 3 days later and forum-ban me for it. That's also a problem. And then I can appeal it and get my ban overturned. That's yet another problem.
Someone else can post a profanity-laced opinionted tirade, but the same mods who agreed with me can disagree with them and ban them for profanity. That's a problem.
I know for a fact some of the shit I've gotten away with on these forums without being banned for it, and I know for a fact there are other people who've done the same things and have gotten punished for it. While I'm sure glad there seem to be some mods and admins who "have my back," that's still a problem. Nobody should "have my back."
If I'm breaking rules, I should be getting punished. And if you think what I'm doing isn't worthy of punishment, even though it breaks a forum rule, then maybe it's time for that forum rule to be deleted.
Originally posted by Novus
Dadd, I love ya, man, but if you're ignoring rules violations, you're part of the problem.
Either you need to start enforcing those rules, or those rules need to be removed.
Ignored = just cuz someone is doing something I don't personally care for doesn't mean I take action
Then, I'm sorry, Dadd, but you're still part of the problem.
You should be enforcing the rules as written. Whether or not you personally care for something or not shouldn't enter the equation.
Personally, I don't mind profanity. Curse away. But if I were a moderator on a site that banned profanity, I'd enforce that ban -- because it would be my JOB to enforce that ban.
Your own personal opinion of forum behavior should not enter the equation at all. And unfortunately, that's a huge problem with this moderating staff.
Things you have no problem with are considered 7-day ban offenses by other mods. That's inconsistent. That's a problem.
I can post a profanity-laced opinionated tirade, a violation of the forum rules on its face, but because 80% of the mods happen to agree with my opinion, they let it slide. That's a problem. Then one more mod can read it 3 days later and forum-ban me for it. That's also a problem. And then I can appeal it and get my ban overturned. That's yet another problem.
Someone else can post a profanity-laced opinionted tirade, but the same mods who agreed with me can disagree with them and ban them for profanity. That's a problem.
I know for a fact some of the shit I've gotten away with on these forums without being banned for it, and I know for a fact there are other people who've done the same things and have gotten punished for it. While I'm sure glad there seem to be some mods and admins who "have my back," that's still a problem. Nobody should "have my back."
If I'm breaking rules, I should be getting punished. And if you think what I'm doing isn't worthy of punishment, even though it breaks a forum rule, then maybe it's time for that forum rule to be deleted.
Edited by Novus on Aug 21, 2012 11:09:20
Dadd
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Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Novus
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Originally posted by Dadd
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Okay then. But that wasn't made clear in your previous post.
And my concern is that too many moderators in here are starting with the question, "Do I like what this person just did?" and then going from there. If that's the first question a mod asks themselves, then they're already doing it wrong.
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Okay then. But that wasn't made clear in your previous post.
And my concern is that too many moderators in here are starting with the question, "Do I like what this person just did?" and then going from there. If that's the first question a mod asks themselves, then they're already doing it wrong.
logwwe
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Originally posted by jdbolick
GLB has to ban nudity for legal reasons, but there's no liability incurred from having a person on your site being called a moron by someone else.
lol, if someone has been banned for calling someone else a moron then there is something definitely wrong with the system.
GLB has to ban nudity for legal reasons, but there's no liability incurred from having a person on your site being called a moron by someone else.
lol, if someone has been banned for calling someone else a moron then there is something definitely wrong with the system.
MadCow420
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Originally posted by Dadd
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
there should be more Mods like this. Mods that will read the reports and find out whats going on, not just ban the person in quiestion because someone like Magic Mike felt the need to send a BS report. I would be a great mod for this reason alone. I have wasted enough time winning appeals for bans that had no reason being enforced because of stupid reports.
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
there should be more Mods like this. Mods that will read the reports and find out whats going on, not just ban the person in quiestion because someone like Magic Mike felt the need to send a BS report. I would be a great mod for this reason alone. I have wasted enough time winning appeals for bans that had no reason being enforced because of stupid reports.
MadCow420
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Originally posted by Novus
Originally posted by Dadd
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Okay then. But that wasn't made clear in your previous post.
And my concern is that too many moderators in here are starting with the question, "Do I like what this person just did?" and then going from there. If that's the first question a mod asks themselves, then they're already doing it wrong.
lol to this.. some of the people who like me the most on GLB, ban me the most. It has nothing to do with them liking you or not. they still enforce the rules. it doesnt matter who it is. Trust me on this lol. I have been learning this the hard way.
Originally posted by Dadd
Ya, there were no rules broken.
Therefore, even though personally I didn't care for it, I ignored it.
Okay then. But that wasn't made clear in your previous post.
And my concern is that too many moderators in here are starting with the question, "Do I like what this person just did?" and then going from there. If that's the first question a mod asks themselves, then they're already doing it wrong.
lol to this.. some of the people who like me the most on GLB, ban me the most. It has nothing to do with them liking you or not. they still enforce the rules. it doesnt matter who it is. Trust me on this lol. I have been learning this the hard way.
Novus
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Originally posted by O' HappyCow
lol to this.. some of the people who like me the most on GLB, ban me the most. It has nothing to do with them liking you or not. they still enforce the rules. it doesnt matter who it is. Trust me on this lol. I have been learning this the hard way.
That hasn't been my experience. See my story up above where I got forum-banned for something I FULLY deserved to be banned for, I used the Appeals form for the sole purpose of trolling Support, and Support approved my "appeal" and overturned my forum ban. It was hilarious to me at the time, and still is, because it highlights how inconsistent the mod staff is here and how much seems to depend on who likes you and who doesn't.
I'm one of the lucky few... for some crazy reason, someone up there seems to like me. And I get away with shit on these forums (there I go again, profanity, ban!) that I've seen others get bant for. That should not be happening. Period.
lol to this.. some of the people who like me the most on GLB, ban me the most. It has nothing to do with them liking you or not. they still enforce the rules. it doesnt matter who it is. Trust me on this lol. I have been learning this the hard way.
That hasn't been my experience. See my story up above where I got forum-banned for something I FULLY deserved to be banned for, I used the Appeals form for the sole purpose of trolling Support, and Support approved my "appeal" and overturned my forum ban. It was hilarious to me at the time, and still is, because it highlights how inconsistent the mod staff is here and how much seems to depend on who likes you and who doesn't.
I'm one of the lucky few... for some crazy reason, someone up there seems to like me. And I get away with shit on these forums (there I go again, profanity, ban!) that I've seen others get bant for. That should not be happening. Period.
Originally posted by mandyross
Creative rude behaviour is fun. That is sadly missing on these forums though.
Psychotically rude behaviour, and unoriginal rude behaviour are completely different. People who systematically insult a multitude of different users on these forums do not make things interesting for others. They are the ones who promote inactivity by driving everyone else away.
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice and going out of their way to target other users. They became inactive, and people had to go to a private forum to have intelligent and civil build advice discussions. It would be great if the general trolling in GLB was eliminated, so the hundreds of agents who post in that forum can migrate back into the GLB build advice forums.
It is extremely tiresome to read threads in GLB forums and the same delusional, boring, idiotic people spam out their token replies time after time. Now that is what promotes the inactivity.
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork.
A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
I don't think he ever said that users should be able to troll without constraints; he only said that there should be more freedom than in the current system since that cultivates relationships and a forum culture.
Originally posted by jdbolick
Considering that you're one of the worst offenders in FAQ, I'm surprised that you feel that way. In the recent energy thread you were repeatedly insulting to me while I kept my cool, but a lot of people like you can't be honest about your behavior, even with yourselves. Regardless, what you say is still wrong. People don't go inactive because someone else was rude to them. People go inactive when there isn't enough that appeals to them.
You're making a good point, don't ruin it with shitty arguments. Attacking him for a previous thread instead of arguing on behalf of your suggestion won't help; it will just get the thread off topic.
Originally posted by Novus
Then, I'm sorry, Dadd, but you're still part of the problem.
You should be enforcing the rules as written. Whether or not you personally care for something or not shouldn't enter the equation.
Personally, I don't mind profanity. Curse away. But if I were a moderator on a site that banned profanity, I'd enforce that ban -- because it would be my JOB to enforce that ban.
Your own personal opinion of forum behavior should not enter the equation at all. And unfortunately, that's a huge problem with this moderating staff.
Things you have no problem with are considered 7-day ban offenses by other mods. That's inconsistent. That's a problem.
I can post a profanity-laced opinionated tirade, a violation of the forum rules on its face, but because 80% of the mods happen to agree with my opinion, they let it slide. That's a problem. Then one more mod can read it 3 days later and forum-ban me for it. That's also a problem. And then I can appeal it and get my ban overturned. That's yet another problem.
Someone else can post a profanity-laced opinionted tirade, but the same mods who agreed with me can disagree with them and ban them for profanity. That's a problem.
I know for a fact some of the shit I've gotten away with on these forums without being banned for it, and I know for a fact there are other people who've done the same things and have gotten punished for it. While I'm sure glad there seem to be some mods and admins who "have my back," that's still a problem. Nobody should "have my back."
If I'm breaking rules, I should be getting punished. And if you think what I'm doing isn't worthy of punishment, even though it breaks a forum rule, then maybe it's time for that forum rule to be deleted.
The way I'm reading his statement is that some mods, when they see something that offends them, will attempt to suspend the user under a rule that doesn't necessarily apply. He is saying that he doesn't do that.
Creative rude behaviour is fun. That is sadly missing on these forums though.
Psychotically rude behaviour, and unoriginal rude behaviour are completely different. People who systematically insult a multitude of different users on these forums do not make things interesting for others. They are the ones who promote inactivity by driving everyone else away.
Case in point: The build advice forums in GLB were repeatedly trolled in the past by people who were deliberately giving out bad build advice and going out of their way to target other users. They became inactive, and people had to go to a private forum to have intelligent and civil build advice discussions. It would be great if the general trolling in GLB was eliminated, so the hundreds of agents who post in that forum can migrate back into the GLB build advice forums.
It is extremely tiresome to read threads in GLB forums and the same delusional, boring, idiotic people spam out their token replies time after time. Now that is what promotes the inactivity.
I'd rather that the worst persistent forum offenders are permanently banned rather than given a free rein to act like tools. Maybe then the GLB forums would become active again as the other posters come out of the woodwork.
A massive -1 to this suggestion as it stands.
I don't think he ever said that users should be able to troll without constraints; he only said that there should be more freedom than in the current system since that cultivates relationships and a forum culture.
Originally posted by jdbolick
Considering that you're one of the worst offenders in FAQ, I'm surprised that you feel that way. In the recent energy thread you were repeatedly insulting to me while I kept my cool, but a lot of people like you can't be honest about your behavior, even with yourselves. Regardless, what you say is still wrong. People don't go inactive because someone else was rude to them. People go inactive when there isn't enough that appeals to them.
You're making a good point, don't ruin it with shitty arguments. Attacking him for a previous thread instead of arguing on behalf of your suggestion won't help; it will just get the thread off topic.
Originally posted by Novus
Then, I'm sorry, Dadd, but you're still part of the problem.
You should be enforcing the rules as written. Whether or not you personally care for something or not shouldn't enter the equation.
Personally, I don't mind profanity. Curse away. But if I were a moderator on a site that banned profanity, I'd enforce that ban -- because it would be my JOB to enforce that ban.
Your own personal opinion of forum behavior should not enter the equation at all. And unfortunately, that's a huge problem with this moderating staff.
Things you have no problem with are considered 7-day ban offenses by other mods. That's inconsistent. That's a problem.
I can post a profanity-laced opinionated tirade, a violation of the forum rules on its face, but because 80% of the mods happen to agree with my opinion, they let it slide. That's a problem. Then one more mod can read it 3 days later and forum-ban me for it. That's also a problem. And then I can appeal it and get my ban overturned. That's yet another problem.
Someone else can post a profanity-laced opinionted tirade, but the same mods who agreed with me can disagree with them and ban them for profanity. That's a problem.
I know for a fact some of the shit I've gotten away with on these forums without being banned for it, and I know for a fact there are other people who've done the same things and have gotten punished for it. While I'm sure glad there seem to be some mods and admins who "have my back," that's still a problem. Nobody should "have my back."
If I'm breaking rules, I should be getting punished. And if you think what I'm doing isn't worthy of punishment, even though it breaks a forum rule, then maybe it's time for that forum rule to be deleted.
The way I'm reading his statement is that some mods, when they see something that offends them, will attempt to suspend the user under a rule that doesn't necessarily apply. He is saying that he doesn't do that.
Dadd
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Originally posted by O' HappyCow
How i read it
magic mike reported one of Dadd's own posts, dadd lol'd and ignored it
I keep waiting for that to happen tbh
How i read it
magic mike reported one of Dadd's own posts, dadd lol'd and ignored it
I keep waiting for that to happen tbh
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