Warrior General Games

Originally posted by UnderDogs
I have seen corners without Ball hawk do that, as I stated before. I would just say that's a decent build.

Just because something happens without having a certain ability doesn't necessarily mean that said ability won't increase the likelihood of it happening. There are plenty of guys out there who build good players capable of doing what a certain VA is associated with. The point is that the VA or whatever is usually (I use that term loosely) supposed to enhance the player's ability to perform those actions. It's not a "either you have this VA or it won't ever happen" kind of thing.

Originally posted by Gooseman
Just because something happens without having a certain ability doesn't necessarily mean that said ability won't increase the likelihood of it happening. There are plenty of guys out there who build good players capable of doing what a certain VA is associated with. The point is that the VA or whatever is usually (I use that term loosely) supposed to enhance the player's ability to perform those actions. It's not a "either you have this VA or it won't ever happen" kind of thing.

OK so good builds don't need ball hawk then? Back to my original point?

Originally posted by UnderDogs
OK so good builds don't need ball hawk then? Back to my original point?

You appear to have problems with reading comprehension. Alternately, you're stupid.

Gooseman: Ball Hawk increases the chances of a CB making a play.
UnderDogs: So you agree Ball Hawk is worthless to CBs?

Originally posted by Zurai
You appear to have problems with reading comprehension. Alternately, you're stupid.

Gooseman: Ball Hawk increases the chances of a CB making a play.
UnderDogs: So you agree Ball Hawk is worthless to CBs?

uncalled for

Bort has said before that MANY CB's would get better benefit from 3rd Down Stopper and Long Reach because they are already so close the boost is practically negligible, one or two ticks.

That being said, I have Ball Hawk my CB at 15, mainly because really how many 3rd downs are there in a game? How many times in a game on 3rd down was the ball thrown? How many times was it thrown at your player?

Don't like Long Reach for the same reasons. First it has to be a pass towards you, second you have to blow the roll, third you have to make the roll by enough to win the pass deflection.

Don't like Clutch either, because the bonuses are unspecified. Hey I proc'ed my Jumping and it is a run play the other way...

I still like the Vision bonus. It is active on every play.

Originally posted by Zurai
You appear to have problems with reading comprehension. Alternately, you're stupid.

Gooseman: Ball Hawk increases the chances of a CB making a play.
UnderDogs: So you agree Ball Hawk is worthless to CBs?

First I said ball hawk is broken because it's in the bugs forum. For starters, that's a fact bud.

Then you said your corner does things like goes across the field and makes plays.

I say I see that on high level corners without ball hawk.

You say you want ball hawk because it makes something happen more.

If this certain something hap-pens every play without ball hawk. What makes you think I want to waste v.a's on it now.


Basically what you're saying is ball hawk helps you do something better, that great builds do anyway.

What I am saying is when I make a good build that does what you think ball hawk is doing anyway, what DO i need ball hawk for.

No need for insults. Try to stay civil. Try to come up with some links where you think ball hawk is making a difference.

I been working with ball hawk for 4 seasons now. There is no difference. at all when my corners have 15 or when they have 0. Plus it's been broken forever now. Has it even been fixed yet?

How's this for comprehension. asshole.

It works well for a safety, not so much anyone else..

Everyone wants their players to have a highlight reel performance on every play. It just isn't set up that way. For one, level of competition has to be considered. I have a lvl 60(USAPL) and a lvl 45 CB(MU #2). Both have 15 Ball Hawk. But, I'm sure BH is not needed as much for the lvl 45. He doesn't have the same abilities as my lvl 60. And, neither does he face the same lvl of competition.

At 60+, players are at 4:1 and 5:1 SP ratios to increase just about anything of importance. So, every player is really looking for that slight edge over the opponent. It's the last season for my lvl 60. With boosts and levelling, he'll only get 20>25 sp's. That's not really that much at 5:1. The points will enhance his build but they won't make a profound change in it.

When it comes to VA's like BH, LR, etc... players are just gaining that slight edge; not a highlight reel ability. BH, LR, etc... are neither unnecessary or must-haves. And, no agent that I know of has any proof to the contrary. It's up to the agents to decide how a VA(and, to what level) is critical to his player's build. The nice thing about BH is that it gives a decent bonus in three different attributes by only investing in one ability. I'd have to spread VA points over three separate attributes to match it.

I've been strongly considering getting rid of LR & BH for my lvl 45 CB and putting the points in Football Genius and other attribute boosts. The bonuses are bigger by going straight to the attributes. But, I have to spread the points between FG, Track Star and Quick instead of taking a smaller lump sum increase to all three player attributes from BH.

Originally posted by tiger46
Everyone wants their players to have a highlight reel performance on every play. It just isn't set up that way. For one, level of competition has to be considered. I have a lvl 60(USAPL) and a lvl 45 CB(MU #2). Both have 15 Ball Hawk. But, I'm sure BH is not needed as much for the lvl 45. He doesn't have the same abilities as my lvl 60. And, neither does he face the same lvl of competition.

At 60+, players are at 4:1 and 5:1 SP ratios to increase just about anything of importance. So, every player is really looking for that slight edge over the opponent. It's the last season for my lvl 60. With boosts and levelling, he'll only get 20>25 sp's. That's not really that much at 5:1. The points will enhance his build but they won't make a profound change in it.

When it comes to VA's like BH, LR, etc... players are just gaining that slight edge; not a highlight reel ability. BH, LR, etc... are neither unnecessary or must-haves. And, no agent that I know of has any proof to the contrary. It's up to the agents to decide how a VA(and, to what level) is critical to his player's build. The nice thing about BH is that it gives a decent bonus in three different attributes by only investing in one ability. I'd have to spread VA points over three separate attributes to match it.

I've been strongly considering getting rid of LR & BH for my lvl 45 CB and putting the points in Football Genius and other attribute boosts. The bonuses are bigger by going straight to the attributes. But, I have to spread the points between FG, Track Star and Quick instead of taking a smaller lump sum increase to all three player attributes from BH.

You're better off with Football genius. If your vision is 69.24 and FG is at 15 you get +5.19 all the time.
When you add more vision it gets even better. I am about to bring his vision up to 74 with 15 football genius and the 48 upgrades he will have over 80 vision....he will still have a ridiculous amount of speed and agility still

Originally posted by tiger46
When it comes to VA's like BH, LR, etc... players are just gaining that slight edge; not a highlight reel ability. BH, LR, etc... are neither unnecessary or must-haves. And, no agent that I know of has any proof to the contrary.

This was the point I was getting at, you probably said it better ha.

Just from what I've seen of my corner and those on my team, I'd say if you're playing tight coverage, you'll rarely notice Ball Hawk kick in. If you're playing back a bit, my guess is you'll actually see faster breaks on the ball.

I'm not really sold on any VAs at this point, so certainly this one might not be worthwhile ... but there's just far too many variables with the sim to rely on seeing it on the screen to use it.

And just for laughs, watch by CB (15 BH, 10 LR) getting burned by a receiver 12 levels his senior:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=699807&pbp_id=820022

For some reason, I'm on aggressive coverage here. Not wise ... and then the terrible missed tackle to boot.

UD, can you link me to the thread where they are discussing BH being bugged? I can't find it in there.

The better you are, the better Ball Hawk is.
I almost want to get it on every player I have tbh. It's an epic VA.

Originally posted by Daddy Warbucks
The better you are, the better Ball Hawk is.
I almost want to get it on every player I have tbh. It's an epic VA.

If you say it's good, then that's all I need to know.

Originally posted by Longhornfan1024
UD, can you link me to the thread where they are discussing BH being bugged? I can't find it in there.

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