Warrior General Games

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by AJHawk

Originally posted by zero


Vision is worthless past a certain number... it has such diminishing returns
Agility

proof??

it's not completely Worthless, but it does get to a point where it's over kill.

This. And my whole deal against it is the posts made by high vision safeties touting how well their safety read a particular play, and then seeing a guy with 48 vision do the EXACT same thing in other replays. I've seen this countless times.

Originally posted by zero
Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by AJHawk
Originally posted by zero
Vision is worthless past a certain number... it has such diminishing returns
Agilityproof??it's not completely Worthless, but it does get to a point where it's over kill.This. And my whole deal against it is the posts made by high vision safeties touting how well their safety read a particular play, and then seeing a guy with 48 vision do the EXACT same thing in other replays. I've seen this countless times.
Are you a tester? If not, what you speak is hyperbole. The same can be said, what you say about vision, about speed, agility, and so on as well.

Originally posted by zero
Originally posted by UnderDogs

Originally posted by AJHawk


Originally posted by zero



Vision is worthless past a certain number... it has such diminishing returns
Agility

proof??

it's not completely Worthless, but it does get to a point where it's over kill.

This. And my whole deal against it is the posts made by high vision safeties touting how well their safety read a particular play, and then seeing a guy with 48 vision do the EXACT same thing in other replays. I've seen this countless times.

Yep MY S.S. will never have 61 vision. NEVER. Maybe if He goes to the Pro's and has problems with pump fakes or something I might raise it. People are nuts about vision on this game.

Originally posted by Challenge Everything

Are you a tester? If not, what you speak is hyperbole. The same can be said, what you say about vision, about speed, agility, and so on as well.

Not really vision safeties see a play and get blocked. My safety sees the play just fine and can actually do something about it.
Anything over 55 vision is over kill. And past 61, you're really hampering your over all build.

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by Challenge Everything


Are you a tester? If not, what you speak is hyperbole. The same can be said, what you say about vision, about speed, agility, and so on as well.

Not really vision safeties see a play and get blocked. My safety sees the play just fine and can actually do something about it.
Anything over 55 vision is over kill. And past 61, you're really hampering your over all build.

that's not 100% true look at people like asheme it works for him just because you made a play without high vision doesn't mean it's not needed

considering all your ints/sacks and 7 of your FF came from blow outs you've got no proof

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Originally posted by Challenge Everything


Are you a tester? If not, what you speak is hyperbole. The same can be said, what you say about vision, about speed, agility, and so on as well.

Not really vision safeties see a play and get blocked. My safety sees the play just fine and can actually do something about it.
Anything over 55 vision is over kill. And past 61, you're really hampering your over all build.

With VP my SS has 72 vision, plus I have AEQ that adds +Super Vision... and I'd hardly say that my build has been "hampered" in any way.

Originally posted by Blamo

With VP my SS has 72 vision, plus I have AEQ that adds +Super Vision... and I'd hardly say that my build has been "hampered" in any way.

you're talking about the level 32 in the A league with hardly any stats?

Stop telling these poor newbs they need THAT MUCH VISION.

Originally posted by Cactus71


considering all your ints/sacks and 7 of your FF came from blow outs you've got no proof

UH ok, and your F.S. isn't worth a crap, even in blowouts. You have hardly any pass deflection, hardly any int's, hardly and tfl's, hardly anything. Give it a rest. We both Play in AAA and you're 8 levels higher.

I am glad I don't have boat loads of vision, it makes mine better as you can clearly tell.

So yeah, let's throw out every game except our 3 losses. In the 3 losses my S.S. has 26 tackles, 1 FF, 12 p.d.'s, 4 tfl's, and 2 hurries.

Which is still more than you have in all those categories for your complete season.

My S.S. also leads the whole league in pass deflections,in African AAA#1. More than the level 50's under him. He doesn't have even close to 60 vision.

So just stop talking. Forum garbage regurgitation imo.

You people promoting vision drive me nuts. YOU DO NOT NEED THAT MUCH VISION. period. You people need to stop coming in here, and clouding up newbies judgments, and telling them how to build shitty players.

holy shit calm the fuck down all I was saying was that vision isn't useless and you shouldn't brag about being good with 48 vision, look at my post did I brag about my FS, no

and FS and SS play in different positions so of course the stats are different

My player has 62 vision, and 9 in supervision. He never gets fooled and knocks down a bunch of passes because he's always in the right place. Vision works.

Originally posted by UnderDogs
Stop telling these poor newbs they need THAT MUCH VISION.
I have read many of your posts and cringe at most everything you say. The post following this quote is also a cringe worthy post.

To the noobs: If you increase your speed, agility, vision to 60/60/60... that is a good base to go off of. If you want to increase them past the 3:1 point, have fun doing so but with the combination of equipment and VA's, increasing those three past that point is not necessary... in my opinion. The "benefit" you get from pushing either of those past that point is negligible if any at all.

UnderDogs, we had this discussion about the importance of vision before.

I've just watched the (few) close games you had. Just some plays to think about:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394495&pbp_id=7608529
(notice strongside throwing off both CB and your guy by early faking; didn't hurt - but still)
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394495&pbp_id=7612113
(notice your SS falling for the pump fake, but catching up immediately for the QB needs too long to actually throw)
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394493&pbp_id=5734042
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394493&pbp_id=5740060
(this QB doesn't give the defense as much time to adjust)

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394495&pbp_id=7608649
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394495&pbp_id=7611142
(this plays show that 55 vision is obviously enough to react quickly to a non-Pump-Fake, non-Quick-Release QB)

So far, the league your SS plays in doesn't seem to have decent fake builds. I saw some speedy TEs and some (low vision?) CBs getting faked out occasionally, but nothing serious. Mostly the CBs and the LOLB get outsprinted though... which gives your guy nice chances for PDs. Seems to be all speed/agility and powerbacks on opponents side.

Given, about 50 vision is enough to make almost all "normal" vision checks and the defensive coordinator likes to blitz the SS a lot, anything higher than 55 vision seems to be a waste. The difference just don't show often enough. So a SS is far better off pushing strength to 70+ and tackling to 60+ - together with 85+ agility and 95+ speed.

On the other hand, IF opponents field a bastard-QB with all Pump Fake (maybe even some VA Quick Release too?) along with Head Fake WR builds, that extra vision might make the difference.

So let the guys decide what path to choose. Saying 60 or 70 vision hurts just isn't fair i.m.h.o. - it's just a different approach.


b.t.w.: http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=394495&pbp_id=7615721 (cover 2 when defending the 0.5?)