Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Ksera
yea but the issue isn't really just sacks....

The 2 starting DEs on my team both are pretty balanced, one favored agility the other speed, both had great pass rush, but even when they played a good team and didn't get sacks, they still were a factor stopping the run. Not any more. I can pretty much promise myself that if we play an equal team, neither one of the DEs will make a single tackle and if they do, it is because the RB ran right into them.

I just played a better team, their LOT is lvl 45 (10 lvls over mine), I had 4 tackles and 1 hurried.

build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

Originally posted by Ksera
build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

He had 4 tackles on their HB running away from the OT he was engaged with. You'll be better off to just ignore BB, he is prone to exaggeration and loves to mis-represent facts to support his "theories".

For instance his hurry came against their second string LOT who's lvl 36, not the lvl 45 he listed.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304682&pbp_id=10757727

BB is our Special Needs DE.

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by Ksera

build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

He had 4 tackles on their HB running away from the OT he was engaged with. You'll be better off to just ignore BB, he is prone to exaggeration and loves to mis-represent facts to support his "theories".

For instance his hurry came against their second string LOT who's lvl 36, not the lvl 45 he listed.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304682&pbp_id=10757727

BB is our Special Needs DE.



Masquerading in signalsqt's attempt at discrediting me is his inconsistencies. He claims that DEs are worthless in equal competition in other posts and absolutely can't do anything, and yet he just noted my DE had a hurried against an even level LOT at lvl 36. But hey, let's not let the facts get in the way shall we signalsqt again? I should just leave you and your fantasy DE-needs-4-6-sacks-a-game gang enjoy this forum unchallenged.

Also, in many of his other posts he claimed DEs will ALWAYS be HELD by OT and thus can't tackle RBs EVER, however, he just posted himself my DE seems to have no problem shedding the "held" by a lvl 45 OT and make 4 tackles on HBs running outside.

Once again i return to my original premise. If you are as shallow as signalsgt, that thinks all DE builders should just pour everything into spd/agi and expect Bort to "fix" it for you so you can put up 8 tackles, 4 sacks in every game, then by all means. Join his parade.

But if you actually want real fun playing in GLB that is always a constant chess-match in knowing what works well, and what doesn't work as well, then DEs are for you.

Yes we are envying why QB seems to be throwing 6000 yards a season, we envy that RBs can rush 10,000 yards a season. We envy WRs that catches 20 passes a game. And we think therefore DEs should be allowed to register 5 sacks a game to be "fun". Knock yourself out then.

Originally posted by Ksera
build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

Again I maintain the recommendation to you all on your build.

It is true Bort significantly changed the way DE is played, it's true in the beginning of this season DE is so screwed that they can't do jack, but it's also true Bort corrected a few calculations that allows DEs to function better, however, this is not a free pass for sacks and tackles like season 5.

It's obvious Bort scaled back on the effectiveness of spd/agi. Now in his new algorithm str, vis, sta play a key role. Obviously no one has figured anything out concrete but conventional wisdom suggest you need a base-str to be effective, a level of vision to be effective, and really a level of stamina to keep your DE performing.

Also Bort scaled back on SAs and now it takes a combination to work well and not just focusing on one or two.

I've seem many open builds on whiners like signalsqt. They usually have 90-100 spd/agi, but not much else. 35-40 str, 30-35 vis and stamina, nothing in Wall, Base SAs, and not that high numbers in FS, TV SAs, and they bitch all day why their DE can't shed a block, make a tackle, or get a sack. Sorry if I feel the need to call out their ignorance.

In all fairness, two of your tackles were due to being in a DE contain coverage on a pitch which led to tackles because the OT was too far away to notice you. It was more good gameplanning than your DE making a play.

edit: I don't believe 5 sacks/game is necessary for fun, I just know how easy it is to lock down DEs myself having a LOT.

Originally posted by Ksera
build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

Those numbers look very good by themselves, but by themselves they won't make your DE great.

What are your numbers for Vision and Stamina? I've notice Vision is needed for making tackles against the Run effective, and Stamina is pretty much needed if you want your DE to be a factor and produce consistently throughout the game.

Then it's your SAs. What is your FS and TV numbers? Also, what about your Wall and Base numbers? I've done enough regressional testing that I'm convinced all 4 of them are needed to get your DE to consistently be a factor in tackles and sacks.

If you neglect any of them than it's not a wonder why your DE is standing there having tea with the OT all game long.

Originally posted by
Masquerading in signalsqt's attempt at discrediting me is his inconsistencies. He claims that DEs are worthless in equal competition in other posts and absolutely can't do anything, and yet he just noted my DE had a hurried against an even level LOT at lvl 36. But hey, let's not let the facts get in the way shall we signalsqt again? I should just leave you and your fantasy DE-needs-4-6-sacks-a-game gang enjoy this forum unchallenged.

Also, in many of his other posts he claimed DEs will ALWAYS be HELD by OT and thus can't tackle RBs EVER, however, he just posted himself my DE seems to have no problem shedding the "held" by a lvl 45 OT and make 4 tackles on HBs running outside.

Once again i return to my original premise. If you are as shallow as signalsgt, that thinks all DE builders should just pour everything into spd/agi and expect Bort to "fix" it for you so you can put up 8 tackles, 4 sacks in every game, then by all means. Join his parade.

But if you actually want real fun playing in GLB that is always a constant chess-match in knowing what works well, and what doesn't work as well, then DEs are for you.

Yes we are envying why QB seems to be throwing 6000 yards a season, we envy that RBs can rush 10,000 yards a season. We envy WRs that catches 20 passes a game. And we think therefore DEs should be allowed to register 5 sacks a game to be "fun". Knock yourself out then.




Wait, so you get caught misrepresenting your stats and it's somehow my fault?

So in 60+ plays, your DE managed one hurry. Glad to see your continuing to misrepresent facts, if you go back and read all my posts I expect 4 to 6 sacks PER TEAM, not per DE against EQUAL level. Against OT's that are 10 levels lower I expect 4 to 6 sacks.

GLB is not a chess match, it is a line of code. Nothing more then IF/Then statements, you tweak that code by your individual settings, however whatever change was made has increased final integer the OT comes up with to a level that DE's can't beat unless they have +11 levels with RARE exceptions.

So for you BB I'll make it simple. If Timmy has 3 apples and Suzy has 2 apples, who has more apples? For the rest of the populace, if the calculation is executed and the OT's final score is 10 and the DE's total score s 8, who wins?

Thank you for clearing things up, your original premise is wrong so every conclusion you come up with based on that premise will be wrong. No one here expects Bort to slant the game in the DE's favor, we just want it to be a level field.

It's been proven your an idiot, embrace it and quit fighting your losing battle.

Originally posted by Motiak
In all fairness, two of your tackles were due to being in a DE contain coverage on a pitch which led to tackles because the OT was too far away to notice you. It was more good gameplanning than your DE making a play.

edit: I don't believe 5 sacks/game is necessary for fun, I just know how easy it is to lock down DEs myself having a LOT.

Good point Motiak. Does your DC put your DE in a position to produce? I take your post as complement since I'm the DC for my team, LOL

I'm just trying to understand why people building DEs think they can cookie-cut a couple of attributes and then whine about the fact that Bort scale back his algorithm to encourage better builds.

Oh, my DE doesn't produce because I'm not far enough along in his build for him to be able to produce. I'm just reading and responding.

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by

Masquerading in signalsqt's attempt at discrediting me is his inconsistencies. He claims that DEs are worthless in equal competition in other posts and absolutely can't do anything, and yet he just noted my DE had a hurried against an even level LOT at lvl 36. But hey, let's not let the facts get in the way shall we signalsqt again? I should just leave you and your fantasy DE-needs-4-6-sacks-a-game gang enjoy this forum unchallenged.

Also, in many of his other posts he claimed DEs will ALWAYS be HELD by OT and thus can't tackle RBs EVER, however, he just posted himself my DE seems to have no problem shedding the "held" by a lvl 45 OT and make 4 tackles on HBs running outside.

Once again i return to my original premise. If you are as shallow as signalsgt, that thinks all DE builders should just pour everything into spd/agi and expect Bort to "fix" it for you so you can put up 8 tackles, 4 sacks in every game, then by all means. Join his parade.

But if you actually want real fun playing in GLB that is always a constant chess-match in knowing what works well, and what doesn't work as well, then DEs are for you.

Yes we are envying why QB seems to be throwing 6000 yards a season, we envy that RBs can rush 10,000 yards a season. We envy WRs that catches 20 passes a game. And we think therefore DEs should be allowed to register 5 sacks a game to be "fun". Knock yourself out then.




Wait, so you get caught misrepresenting your stats and it's somehow my fault?

So in 60+ plays, your DE managed one hurry. Glad to see your continuing to misrepresent facts, if you go back and read all my posts I expect 4 to 6 sacks PER TEAM, not per DE against EQUAL level. Against OT's that are 10 levels lower I expect 4 to 6 sacks.

GLB is not a chess match, it is a line of code. Nothing more then IF/Then statements, you tweak that code by your individual settings, however whatever change was made has increased final integer the OT comes up with to a level that DE's can't beat unless they have +11 levels with RARE exceptions.

So for you BB I'll make it simple. If Timmy has 3 apples and Suzy has 2 apples, who has more apples? For the rest of the populace, if the calculation is executed and the OT's final score is 10 and the DE's total score s 8, who wins?

Thank you for clearing things up, your original premise is wrong so every conclusion you come up with based on that premise will be wrong. No one here expects Bort to slant the game in the DE's favor, we just want it to be a level field.

It's been proven your an idiot, embrace it and quit fighting your losing battle.





Wrong again. You made the following premises in your other ridiculous posts:

1) No DE can do anything effect against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
2) No DE can shed a block against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
3) A DE should be able to cookie-cut spd/agi and ignore others and put up 4-6 sacks a game. I've proven you ridiculous.

If you can't handle the truth then don't play in GLB.

Then again this is a kind of forum for people to whine, so whine. But don't whine to me for showing your idiocies in your posts.

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by Ksera

build?

One DE of out had 101 speed, 72 agility and 65 strength.
The other had 103 agility, 75 speed and 70 strength.

Both is before AE.....

He had 4 tackles on their HB running away from the OT he was engaged with. You'll be better off to just ignore BB, he is prone to exaggeration and loves to mis-represent facts to support his "theories".

For instance his hurry came against their second string LOT who's lvl 36, not the lvl 45 he listed.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304682&pbp_id=10757727

BB is our Special Needs DE.




Shed Block pressure against an OT of equal lvl (notice how quickly I get around the OT of equal build AND shed block)

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304682&pbp_id=10757727


Shed Block tackle against an OT that's 10 lvls higher than mine

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304682&pbp_id=10751842


But why let facts stand in the way right signalsqt? Let's keep whining that DE can't do anything against equal or OT 10 lvls higher and are destine to be held up at line of scrimmage all game long.

Originally posted by
Wrong again. You made the following premises in your other ridiculous posts:

1) No DE can do anything effect against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
2) No DE can shed a block against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
3) A DE should be able to cookie-cut spd/agi and ignore others and put up 4-6 sacks a game. I've proven you ridiculous.

If you can't handle the truth then don't play in GLB.

Then again this is a kind of forum for people to whine, so whine. But don't whine to me for showing your idiocies in your posts.


1. You haven't proven anything, all of your stats that you proudly brag about have been proven to be against MUCH lower level players.
2. You have given examples that yes it can happen. Using your last game, 58 plays with one hurry, that comes down to a 0.017241379310344827%
3. This is your new argument? That I have a "cookie cutter" build? Keep it up strawman


Remember these plays?? Care to explain them?


http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8508878 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8509751 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=350636

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8512774 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881

Originally posted by Signalsgt
Originally posted by

Wrong again. You made the following premises in your other ridiculous posts:

1) No DE can do anything effect against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
2) No DE can shed a block against equal or better OT. I've proven you wrong
3) A DE should be able to cookie-cut spd/agi and ignore others and put up 4-6 sacks a game. I've proven you ridiculous.

If you can't handle the truth then don't play in GLB.

Then again this is a kind of forum for people to whine, so whine. But don't whine to me for showing your idiocies in your posts.


1. You haven't proven anything, all of your stats that you proudly brag about have been proven to be against MUCH lower level players.
2. You have given examples that yes it can happen. Using your last game, 58 plays with one hurry, that comes down to a 0.017241379310344827%
3. This is your new argument? That I have a "cookie cutter" build? Keep it up strawman


Remember these plays?? Care to explain them?


http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8508878 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8509751 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=350636

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=304619&pbp_id=8512774 -
Sack against http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=104881



Oh please. Don't dance around the issue and make strawman arguments if you're losing and being exposed as a fool.

My challenges are simple:

1) YOU claim DEs are worthless against equal competition or better. I HAVE SHOWN you that that is NOT the case. DEs can still produce if you build them right and not use the old cookie-cut mentality of only spd/agi

2) YOU claim DEs are worthless because they are held up all the time. I HAVE SHOWN you that is NOT the case. DEs can shed block if you build them right.

3) YOU claim DE owners should enjoy 4-6 sacks a game regardless. I REPLIED you're nuts.

It's really very simple. Don't try to draw strawman arguments as it only makes you look foolish.

Originally posted by BiggerBlue

My challenges are simple:

1) YOU claim DEs are worthless against equal competition or better. I HAVE SHOWN you that that is NOT the case. DEs can still produce if you build them right and not use the old cookie-cut mentality of only spd/agi

2) YOU claim DEs are worthless because they are held up all the time. I HAVE SHOWN you that is NOT the case. DEs can shed block if you build them right.

3) YOU claim DE owners should enjoy 4-6 sacks a game regardless. I REPLIED you're nuts.

It's really very simple. Don't try to draw strawman arguments as it only makes you look foolish.


Actually, i thought he meant a team should get 4-6 sacks. Which is reasonable when you consider that a WR or a RB's bench mark for a decent year in GLB is 2000 yards... so if there's is double of RL, why shouldn't ours?

And yeah, if i play a gutted team with a CPU guy 15 levels below me, i should get 20 sacks... put Demarcus ware in a NCAA dicision II game and see if he doesn't get 20...

And holding is 30 times stronger than the ability to Shed a block...why 30? i looked at my last 5 games and figured that i get held 30 times for every 1 that i slip out of (not counting times hwhere i'm too quick to hold in the first place).

And if you're going to blame other people's builds (or mine) i'll remind you that the details of my build are in this thread...as are yours...and my build destroys yours.