Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Ryiotgear
Originally posted by Viscount

It has nothing to do with it, it only affests how much speed you loose when changing direction. Check out my level 17 HB with 94 speed and 37 agility repeatedly outrun level 30+ defenders:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3186354
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3181861
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3182432
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3941753
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3937880

To be fair in those first 3 replays the HB beats an equal level 17 FS to the corner in each. In #2 he also beats a horribly built RILB with only 37 speed. The last 2 are pretty impressive though and there is the significant level difference between the SS in #4 and the CB in #5

I'm going to have to disagree on the acceleration factor. This season I've been testing a lot of different combinations of speed and agility gear on my HB and I've been using kickoffs to measure acceleration as it isn't always clear on plays coming out of the backfield with all the factors involved.

Unfortunately in the 2 games in question we never kicked off first so there is a small stamina impact that you must consider, but it actually goes to help the cause that agility aids in acceleration. My HB is on the far right side in each of these replays.

1) 83 Speed, 79 Agility (During first drive was in 3 plays, with 2 carries; then the following kickoff occured):
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=351939&pbp_id=3443537
13 ticks = pass 25 yrd line
25 ticks = pass 30 yrd line
37 ticks = pass 35 yrd line
49 ticks = pass 40 yrd line
61 ticks = pass 45 yrd line

2) 95 Speed, 67 Agility (During first drive was in 1 play, with 0 carries; then the following kickoff occured):
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=353004&pbp_id=4260254
15 ticks = pass 25 yrd line
26 ticks = pass 30 yrd line
37 ticks = pass 35 yrd line
48 ticks = pass 40 yrd line
59 ticks = pass 45 yrd line

That is with +12 agility, -12 speed that I am seeing acceleration move me faster over the first 10 yards or so. Eventually at the 15 yard mark my HB with speed equip begins to surpass the version with agility equip on. If you take away the 2 extra plays and 2 carries from the agility equipped back he may get another tick or 2 on the speed back depending on how much stamina impacted attributes

Then the question becomes "Is it worth it?" A difference of 12 agility is only a couple ticks. It seems such a small amount.

Originally posted by taz20075
Originally posted by Ryiotgear

Originally posted by Viscount


It has nothing to do with it, it only affests how much speed you loose when changing direction. Check out my level 17 HB with 94 speed and 37 agility repeatedly outrun level 30+ defenders:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3186354
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3181861
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3182432
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3941753
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3937880

To be fair in those first 3 replays the HB beats an equal level 17 FS to the corner in each. In #2 he also beats a horribly built RILB with only 37 speed. The last 2 are pretty impressive though and there is the significant level difference between the SS in #4 and the CB in #5

I'm going to have to disagree on the acceleration factor. This season I've been testing a lot of different combinations of speed and agility gear on my HB and I've been using kickoffs to measure acceleration as it isn't always clear on plays coming out of the backfield with all the factors involved.

Unfortunately in the 2 games in question we never kicked off first so there is a small stamina impact that you must consider, but it actually goes to help the cause that agility aids in acceleration. My HB is on the far right side in each of these replays.

1) 83 Speed, 79 Agility (During first drive was in 3 plays, with 2 carries; then the following kickoff occured):
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=351939&pbp_id=3443537
13 ticks = pass 25 yrd line
25 ticks = pass 30 yrd line
37 ticks = pass 35 yrd line
49 ticks = pass 40 yrd line
61 ticks = pass 45 yrd line

2) 95 Speed, 67 Agility (During first drive was in 1 play, with 0 carries; then the following kickoff occured):
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=353004&pbp_id=4260254
15 ticks = pass 25 yrd line
26 ticks = pass 30 yrd line
37 ticks = pass 35 yrd line
48 ticks = pass 40 yrd line
59 ticks = pass 45 yrd line

That is with +12 agility, -12 speed that I am seeing acceleration move me faster over the first 10 yards or so. Eventually at the 15 yard mark my HB with speed equip begins to surpass the version with agility equip on. If you take away the 2 extra plays and 2 carries from the agility equipped back he may get another tick or 2 on the speed back depending on how much stamina impacted attributes

Then the question becomes "Is it worth it?" A difference of 12 agility is only a couple ticks. It seems such a small amount.

Well that's also 12 less speed.

To really show the effect of the agility they need to do a comparison of 83 speed 79 agility and 83 speed 67 agility.

Riggs is right - the couple tick advantage in acceleration is obtained not just with a +12 point edge in agility - all else is not equal. That back also has 12 less speed - in that regard it isn't a true scientific test, just the same HB wearing 2 different sets of equipment so it is a +/- on speed/agility, but I can guarantee that every other attribute except speed/agility is the exact same in those two plays

I think "is it worth it" depends on what you are going for with your build. You can see from the kickoff the acceleration increase from more agility only makes a difference for ~12 yards (and arguably a meaningful difference for the first 5 or so yards) before the speed HB starts to overtake the agility HB - if you are building a speed back that is within an offense where it is critical to get from point A to B as fast as possible speed >> agility is probably the way to go. If your speed is going to be a lot higher than agility I believe this should also factor into your decision on which VAs and special abilities you invest in and also your running style setting and I'm beginning to believe vision is a lot more important for a true elusive back than it is for a speed back.

Essentially higher agility in relation to speed will come in handy when making lots of cuts and/or stop and start moves (repeatedly accelerating on the same play), I believe it does help some of the specials kick in more often (juke & spin come to mind). The final thing I'm trying to test out is what raising/decreasing vision does with different combinations of speed/agility - I have some test vision equipment and temp boosts to try and gather some data points - it is hard to get anything conclusive here, but right now my "gut" is telling me my HB looks better running with more vision (a +9 to the attribute) when he is more equally aligned in the speed/agility attributes compared to a full speed back.

Originally posted by Viscount
Originally posted by ssaints4ever

Originally posted by Viscount


It has nothing to do with it, it only affests how much speed you loose when changing direction. Check out my level 17 HB with 94 speed and 37 agility repeatedly outrun level 30+ defenders:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3186354
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3181861
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321524&pbp_id=3182432
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3941753
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=321500&pbp_id=3937880

I would expect a player with 94 speed to be much faster tbh

Well he does only have 20 stamina and plays games on Normal, anyway he doesn't look any slower than my HB with 95 speed and 67 agility (his build's open):

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=300599&pbp_id=1962964
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=300599&pbp_id=1958392

um a 7 and 11 yard rush doesn't show off someone's speed at all

Did anyone think maybe that kick offs are nerfed? Meaning if players have over x amount of speed then they will run at x base rate of speed. Ive seen people bitching about returns. Maybe the test should be ran on the stem of a deep post or something? I honestly dont know, just speculating.