Warrior General Games

Originally posted by wallysmith
Also, vision helps with pre-snap reads; if your vision is high enough your player can predict what type of play it is and will react accordingly.

If by that you mean "reads run, doesn't go into coverage", that is completely false.

Think what you want, but Bort has stated in the Bug forums that players are able to make pre-snap reads depending on how high their vision is. I believe the original thread was on a SS or LB blitzing when that particular defensive AI formation didn't have that player blitzing.

Originally posted by wallysmith
Think what you want, but Bort has stated in the Bug forums that players are able to make pre-snap reads depending on how high their vision is. I believe the original thread was on a SS or LB blitzing when that particular defensive AI formation didn't have that player blitzing.

On my team if I have 0 blitzes set in my AI for a play, the SS will always blitz on that play regardless of whether it's a pass or run. He's not making any read he just automatically blitzes.

Back to my topic, What does confidence do?!

Originally posted by wallysmith
Think what you want, but Bort has stated in the Bug forums that players are able to make pre-snap reads depending on how high their vision is. I believe the original thread was on a SS or LB blitzing when that particular defensive AI formation didn't have that player blitzing.

It isn't "thinking" what I want.

My LB with 80 vision NEVER "makes the read". He never decides to blitz and get a tackle for loss when he wasn't originally planned to blitz. He never decides to "Stay home" if he reads a run, he always goes and covers the WR, and is usually the last to break off of him.

If you honestly think LB's will go against the AI and make big plays based on vision, you are very sorely mistaken.

I never made any claims on how the player will react, I'm just parroting what was stated by Bort; stop putting words in my mouth. Whether or not making pre-snap reads/reactions is implemented correctly is certainly up for debate, but the fact is it's in the game. Maybe the coding definition of making the pre-snap read is "reacts to play 3 ticks faster" instead of your assumption of "passing play; go for the blitz." Who knows?

We all know how vague Bort is and how flawed elements can be in this game, but the fact is that "making pre-snap reads based on vision" IS in the code.

Vision DOES help when blitzing...high vision means less of a blitz delay, but as for reading plays pre-snap, I've yet to see it do a thing, and reading and reacting faster...not really.

Originally posted by Deathblade

Vision doesn't do anything. It actually having an effect on anything is a myth.


Originally posted by Deathblade


My 24 LB has 80 vision and 60 agility, and reacts just as quick to plays, if not slower than my SS with 12 vision.

The only thing vision MAY help with is getting faked.


Originally posted by Deathblade
Vision DOES help when blitzing...high vision means less of a blitz delay, but as for reading plays pre-snap, I've yet to see it do a thing, and reading and reacting faster...not really.

Wait... you're all over the place now. First vision does nothing, then it may help with fakes, then it DOES help when blitzing?

In any case, you haven't really said anything to disprove what I've said. All I'm saying is that the implementation of "pre-snap reads" is in the game, and its effectiveness is up for debate. Considering all the balancing still needed for this game, it's very likely that there will be continued updates to Vision's effects (along with a slew of other things) in future offseasons.... obviously, this will also affect pre-snap reads.

That's not really all over the place tbh. The blitz delay is pretty much a joke. He lowered it to like 30 vision or something. As for fakes, it says it helps, but who knows if it actually does?

And I can't really "disprove" what you said. You said that Bort said it helps with pre-snap stuff. I said, I haven't seen it, even on my LB with 80 vision. You said, well Bort said it did. What am I going to do? Go back and find where he didn't say it?

Originally posted by Deathblade
That's not really all over the place tbh. The blitz delay is pretty much a joke. He lowered it to like 30 vision or something. As for fakes, it says it helps, but who knows if it actually does?

And I can't really "disprove" what you said. You said that Bort said it helps with pre-snap stuff. I said, I haven't seen it, even on my LB with 80 vision. You said, well Bort said it did. What am I going to do? Go back and find where he didn't say it?

True, maybe it's not all over the place; its just completely backtracking and contradicting your own statements earlier in this thread.

As for "disproving" whatever I said, the disconnect happened when you tried interpreting my statement in your own way. If your LB with 80 vision doesn't show it in a way that you expect, does that mean it doesn't exist? You can't "see" the General skills but does that mean they don't exist? All I said was vision helps with pre-snap reads and your player will react to the read; how that is manifested is a completely different story.

Sidenote: Your LB has 80 vision? Really? For someone who is so adamant against the effectiveness of vision, I find that incredibly hard to believe. That would mean that vision is at least at the 3:1 cap, and you have 20 points of equipment invested in it. Seeing as how your highest levelled LB is at lvl 24, that would mean zero slots are used for speed/agility (maybe your custom piece) and you've spent your time building your LB in a direction that you completely don't believe in.

Originally posted by wallysmith
Sidenote: Your LB has 80 vision? Really? For someone who is so adamant against the effectiveness of vision, I find that incredibly hard to believe.

It's called an experiment.

The experiment of vision failed pretty much.

lmao

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by wallysmith

Sidenote: Your LB has 80 vision? Really? For someone who is so adamant against the effectiveness of vision, I find that incredibly hard to believe.

It's called an experiment.

The experiment of vision failed pretty much.

If your level 24 has 80 vision and not much elsewhere, I'm not surprised it failed. Building an all-speed or all-agility or all-vision LB WILL fail. You probably need to design a better experiment.

Originally posted by wallysmith
Originally posted by Deathblade

Originally posted by wallysmith


Sidenote: Your LB has 80 vision? Really? For someone who is so adamant against the effectiveness of vision, I find that incredibly hard to believe.

It's called an experiment.

The experiment of vision failed pretty much.

If your level 24 has 80 vision and not much elsewhere, I'm not surprised it failed. Building an all-speed or all-agility or all-vision LB WILL fail. You probably need to design a better experiment.

Getting vision to 60 natural by level 24 does not consume that much SP. You can achieve that by level 10 if you really wanted to. He has 60 agility and I imagine at least 50 speed (probably more).