Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Warwynd
It was also sold as a means to put teams where they belong in terms of competition. And tell me you are being challenged at all in this league. We both should have been promoted to a next higher level or they should have dropped more of these teams down and promoted more from Da 7. Right? I mean I don't think either of us has played the Tarheels this season but No one else has even made it close for us except each other... but if we were still here how many of these games would have been like... Oooo this one is gonna be tough, or that one there will cause me to lose sleep.

We played the Tarheels right after we played you. They were our second most challenging game after the Kittens. The only other team that has given us much fight was the Bayou Bandits. We have Las Vegas up next. That one should be competitive. But there's no doubt the competition has been less than desired. I haven't even scouted or put up gameplans for the past 3 games. It simply hasn't been worth my time. I never did that in da 7. I never felt like I could afford to.

Originally posted by kcfdx
Originally posted by Warwynd

It was also sold as a means to put teams where they belong in terms of competition. And tell me you are being challenged at all in this league. We both should have been promoted to a next higher level or they should have dropped more of these teams down and promoted more from Da 7. Right? I mean I don't think either of us has played the Tarheels this season but No one else has even made it close for us except each other... but if we were still here how many of these games would have been like... Oooo this one is gonna be tough, or that one there will cause me to lose sleep.

We played the Tarheels right after we played you. They were our second most challenging game after the Kittens. The only other team that has given us much fight was the Bayou Bandits. We have Las Vegas up next. That one should be competitive. But there's no doubt the competition has been less than desired. I haven't even scouted or put up gameplans for the past 3 games. It simply hasn't been worth my time. I never did that in da 7. I never felt like I could afford to.

Exactly.

Oh I just talked to the owner and he's doing a slow build for the team where they are looking to get the ENTIRE team up to over 100 speed.

Originally posted by Warwynd
Originally posted by kcfdx

Originally posted by Warwynd


It was also sold as a means to put teams where they belong in terms of competition. And tell me you are being challenged at all in this league. We both should have been promoted to a next higher level or they should have dropped more of these teams down and promoted more from Da 7. Right? I mean I don't think either of us has played the Tarheels this season but No one else has even made it close for us except each other... but if we were still here how many of these games would have been like... Oooo this one is gonna be tough, or that one there will cause me to lose sleep.

We played the Tarheels right after we played you. They were our second most challenging game after the Kittens. The only other team that has given us much fight was the Bayou Bandits. We have Las Vegas up next. That one should be competitive. But there's no doubt the competition has been less than desired. I haven't even scouted or put up gameplans for the past 3 games. It simply hasn't been worth my time. I never did that in da 7. I never felt like I could afford to.

Exactly.

And now with the rise of Cleveland and a few of the other perennial bottom feeders even the gimme games have a slight bit of upset factor.

Originally posted by Raves
Oh I just talked to the owner and he's doing a slow build for the team where they are looking to get the ENTIRE team up to over 100 speed.


Wow. Those will be some fast, but crappy O-linemen. lol

I assume he meant the defense and skill positions on offense. At least I hope so.

I know this is pretty much just a complaint thread about how restructuring turned out, and not really a place where any solutions are put forth, I understand that completely.

I aint completely happy, either, with how things turned out. I personally would have been ok with moving to a league I would be more competitive in THIS season, instead of waiting around to maybe be competitive here by season 8. all things considered, I dont see how Bort could have been done differently and still keep his customers.

But I am bored, and came up with a few ways that WOULD increase competition (at the cost of 15 pages of complaints on the forums).

1. Gather all the teams together and, by power rankings, put the strongest in USA Pro. Work down the Pros, region by region, then start at USA AAA. So forth and so on.

competition would be way up, regional integrity would be gone with the wind. So would rivalries, unless two teams got lucky.

That was an option, and there was so much bellyaching and griping about the possibility of moving from region to region to make the teams more competitive that there was no way it was going to be done that way. Some people waited a long time to get a team in a USA league, and those were the ones who put up the most fuss.

2. shuffle every season, within the region, with all the stronger teams put at the top, filtering on down, disregarding promotion trees. Just make the whole region evenly matched all the way down, with the dregs in the BBBs. To just do it by promotion tree wouldn't solve a thing. The promotion trees are by no means evenly matched with good teams and poor teams.

I would have favored this way, until I met you guys. Competition is up. But rivalries and the closer friendships that evolve over seasons would be pretty much gone, again, until a couple seasons pass. There would have been so much bellyaching about doing it this way, I can understand why Bort didn't. People would scream bloody murder. Making the Pros through a league wide shuffle would also take away from the satisfaction of winning to get there.

The way I see it, Bort went with the lesser of 3 evils. This way will take a few seasons to even out the top competitors, but will also keep some of the rivalries intact as teams promote. it will also take care of gutting at the high levels, eventually.

Look at the USA 4 now.

5 BBB 7 teams from last season are in the top 4 of their conference. 3 of the top spots in one conference are all BBB 7. I'm betting at least 4 of the 5 will move to AA at the end of this season, maybe all 5, and probably the same number will move from BBB to A. More from AA and A will move down, and CPU owned teams will take the plunge to BBB. That seems to be taking care of some of the competiveness issue, if not as quickly as most prefer.

I read acres and acres of posts about this crap last season, as I was one of the ones who were in limbo wondering where I would be at the end of season 5. Believe me, everthing was covered (I've never seen so much whining, no matter what was proposed), and this way, while maybe not perfect, is the best way possible to keep regions and a modicum of rivalries intact while increasing competitiveness at higher tiers of a league.

That is what we all want, in the end.

Jack the Pirate

Your arguments are well thought out and I see your point, but I feel that the moving the two teams that make the playoffs up and the two lowest teams from each conference down is the best solution. My complaint is simply that if Bort was gonna do this to level the playing field or place teams where they would be more competitive or whatever, then he failed in that. As both Red Bank and Louisville have demonstrated in the A4. I'm not talking trash to you man. Just saying that I am not a fan of the way the restructuring worked out.

Warwynd... this is starting to make me wonder. I am not trying to insult your intelligence, you are obviously a smart fellow, but I am not sure you understand how this new system works overall.

This is exactly the way you state, but on steroids. it moves the uncompetetive teams down faster, and the competetive ones up faster.

You are in A, along with teams that would still be here in BBB, and next season a few of you will be in AA. Meanwhile 3 or 4 teams will be plummeting past you every season in the other direction, instead of 2.

Isn't that what you want?

Jack the Pirate

If the promotion/relegation count was increased a little, it would give the same effect. The only difference is, the teams who move up will be ones who actually deserve it (i.e. Lycans, etc.) Restructuring is attempting to do the same thing, but it isn't working. It would be best to just let things move up and down as they naturally would, because gutted teams will always get relegated, no matter what league they play in. There's no reason to ruin a good league like the BBB 7, not to mention mixing up the East and West teams, just to try and fix a problem that is constant every season. There will always be gutted teams, so why should we punish competitive lower leagues? Right now, the A4 is just as non-competitive as the BBB 7. I would have rather had the same teams around to beat on (i.e. Richmond) than to mix up the leagues.

Edit: No offense to Richmond with that last statement. I know you guys aren't the same team that you used to be.

^That is pretty much exactly what I was saying. Plus, I kinda wanna be able to say every year that I deserved to be the one that got promoted. You know if we had lost last years playoff game to Red Bank (no shame in that) then we would have stayed here under the older system. But with this system we also would have gotten promoted. It would have felt kinda like we didn't earn it. I don't begrudge the other teams that got promoted (God knows that I enjoy having Red Bank and Tarheels up here with us) but I'd prefer myself to make the championship game before getting promoted. I guess it comes down to personal preference, but that is the way I look at it...

Originally posted by KrackMan
If the promotion/relegation count was increased a little, it would give the same effect.

That's exactly what they did, except they moved the CPU controlled teams all the way to the bottom in that promotion tree.

*chuckle*

So.. I take it you two want the old system back in place. I agree that winning the conference to get promoted would be more satisfying. The problem is that just wasn't good enough to fix the huge disparities in the upper levels of the promotion tree.

Wasn't the lack of competitiveness at the high levels what prompted the whole clamor for restructuring in the first place? Now I see people say they want more competitiveness, but they also want it back to the "old way".

You guys crack me up. I mean no offense, friends. I do consider everyone here to be a friend. I just don't understand you! *grin*

Jack the Pirate