Warrior General Games

Originally posted by RayRay99
http://i43.tinypic.com/2d9dwkn.gif

The lack of quality recruiting in the Big XII is relegating it to Mountain West status.

Still the bitter ex

Originally posted by mwoods07
Apparently ESPN doesn't agree with you:
http://espn.go.com/college-football/statistics/player/_/stat/passing/sort/collegeQuarterbackRating

Besides, Winston might get to play Bama...and FSU doesn't have to pass 100000000 times a game so he wont have the numbers...if A&M wasn't such a crappy team Manziel could work the clock sometimes and his stats would look different.


LOL at QBR, that is a crappy made up metric ESPN wants to force down people's throats to make it relevant.

BTW, A&M doesn't pass 10000000 times a game, we have rushed 382 times and passed 375 times, can't get much more balanced than that. We are ranked 11th in the BCS, losing two games by a total of 11 points, so our team must not be that crappy.

Originally posted by jtrav21
Still the bitter ex

Just reporting facts, I can't help it if the truth hurts

Originally posted by RayRay99
Johnny put up 42 against Bama, totaling 562 total yards.

...

As for 10 games vs. 9, like I said, he only played 1 quarter of Rice and barely more than a half in 3 other games.

As if Winston didn't put up great numbers against Clemson?
As if Winston hasn't been pulled late in blowouts?

Bottom line, you can't just look having roughly 25% more raw yards and TDs passing and ignore the fact that Manziel has 30% more pass attempts than Winston, especially when Winston will make up some of that quantity by playing an extra game (or two) down the stretch.
Winston has more yards per attempt, more TDs per attempt, and fewer INTs per attempt. Now Manziel has better rushing stats so I'm not saying he isn't in the conversation. But it certainly is not a joke to have Winston over Manziel at this point based on stats.

In the games Manziel got pulled he still dominated the games. Winston has been impressive, but Manziel has been better. Florida State's offense depends on their halfbacks rushing much more than ours does. Johnny having more pass attempts is a bonus in favor of him, not a defense of Winston.

I would take Manziel over Winston any day.

He was a shithead in the off-season, but he has been a warrior on the field since being benched in the first game.

Last year, JFF won the Heisman despite two losses. And in those losses, he averaged 268 ypg total offense and only 4.47 yards per play. In his wins last year (including the bowl, which was not included in Heisman voting), he averaged 416/game. and like 8.9 yards per play.

This year, he has sat out more during our victories than he did last year, and in our wins he is averaging 358/game, and his yards per play is 9.05 (so still up from last year's wins).

Now get this. In losses this year, he is averaging 532 yards per game and 9.76 yards per play.

The production during wins is the same, essentially. The production during losses is literally DOUBLE what he did last year. HEISMAN.

Originally posted by RayRay99
Johnny having more pass attempts is a bonus in favor of him, not a defense of Winston.

No actually it's more of an indictment of A&M's defense. If FSU needed Winston to do more offensively they would ask him to do more, it's not Winston's fault the 'Noles defense doesn't give up 35 points every other week. It's not Winston's fault Manziel has better receivers.

Like I said last page, it's not all about stats. I mean, you are basically sitting there saying oh he had more stats in the losses so if he won before he has to win again! That is a horrible argument. Never mind that, with the same number of losses, he has less wins than last season (since the season is still ongoing). Never mind that he didn't beat Alabama this year which was the thing that really vaulted him to the top last season.

You are blind to everything but yards and TD stats right now. Winston is playing lights-out on an undefeated team with 2 wins over teams that were top-7 at the time. A&M hasn't beat a single team this year that is ranked or was ranked at the time they played them. Not one! What's their best win this year? Ole Miss? And you want to hand him the Heisman right now. That is pure homerism on your part.

Again Manziel is definitely in the conversation but to say it's a joke if Winston wins, when you don't even know how the A&M/LSU game will play out (Manziel's third chance to get a signature win for the season) and you don't know what Winston is going to do in his last 4 games (not including the bowl game). At least let the Aggies/Tigers game play out and let Winston catch up on number of games played before you crown your boy's ass.

Please tell FSU to play some relevant teams. Clemson is ok, Miami is ok, Florida is riddle with injuries and is now a joke.
Who else have they played?

Please tell A&M to beat some relevant teams.

I'm not going to sit here and say that Miami and Clemson are as good as Auburn and Alabama, but FSU won their toughest games and A&M didn't. Heisman voters can and should take that into consideration. Furthermore, if you look at the computer polls, FSU's schedule is comparable to A&M's. (Colley has FSU's schedule #51 and A&M's #45. Sagarin has FSU's schedule #62 and A&M's #51.) So let's not act like the Aggies are have been playing the likes of Bama/Auburn/Georgia/S.Carolina/LSU/Missouri consistently throughout their 10-game schedule so far, they have only played against two of the premier teams in the conference so far this year and they have played 4 non-conference opponents that were all shitty.
A&M does add two more very tough opponents to the end of their schedule but again you are putting the cart before the horse talking about a future FSU opponent being weak*. If A&M wins their remaining big games it will boost Manziel's stock and justifiably so. Of course if they lose one RayRay99 is going to come back here and say well he lost 3 games compared to 2 last year but his stats were better so he should keep the Heisman.

*And since you brought it up, Florida's defense is still formidable despite all the injuries. The offense puts them in terrible field position often so the points allowed doesn't quite reflect it but they are still very good on that side of the ball. I have no doubt the Noles will win that game handily but how he looks against that defense will be relevant in my mind.

I just think it is funny how no one but "The Man" is any good and should win the heisman in Manziels eyes. Can you imagine, a QB with 4 losses winning the trophy? Not to say it can't ever happen, but come on, if you are that good, stop putting the blame on everyone else on your team and win the games that matter..

If FSU takes a loss before the BCS title game, Winston does not deserve the trophy unless there is no other undefeated team. If Baylor wins out and beats a quality opponent in a bowl, then Petty likely should get the trophy. If you can't win, you prolly don't deserve it.

Also, looks like an investigation from 2012 is hitting Winston...if the allegations turn out to be true and he did do some egregious act, he should automatically be removed from consideration!

Originally posted by mwoods07
I just think it is funny how no one but "The Man" is any good and should win the heisman in Manziels eyes. Can you imagine, a QB with 4 losses winning the trophy? Not to say it can't ever happen, but come on, if you are that good, stop putting the blame on everyone else on your team and win the games that matter..

If FSU takes a loss before the BCS title game, Winston does not deserve the trophy unless there is no other undefeated team. If Baylor wins out and beats a quality opponent in a bowl, then Petty likely should get the trophy. If you can't win, you prolly don't deserve it.

Also, looks like an investigation from 2012 is hitting Winston...if the allegations turn out to be true and he did do some egregious act, he should automatically be removed from consideration!

I never said Winston wasn't good, he is very good. Johnny is just better.

Tebow won the Heisman when Florida went 9-4

Baylor could go undefeated and a 1 loss Oregon or Florida State would still play in the title game ahead of them. Speaking of soft schedules, Baylor hasn't played any team worth a damn at all.

Curious to see how the mud slinging against Winston goes. If Johnny would have been accused of rape it would be a topic non-stop for 3 months.

Originally posted by TrevJo
Please tell A&M to beat some relevant teams.

I'm not going to sit here and say that Miami and Clemson are as good as Auburn and Alabama, but FSU won their toughest games and A&M didn't. Heisman voters can and should take that into consideration. Furthermore, if you look at the computer polls, FSU's schedule is comparable to A&M's. (Colley has FSU's schedule #51 and A&M's #45. Sagarin has FSU's schedule #62 and A&M's #51.) So let's not act like the Aggies are have been playing the likes of Bama/Auburn/Georgia/S.Carolina/LSU/Missouri consistently throughout their 10-game schedule so far, they have only played against two of the premier teams in the conference so far this year and they have played 4 non-conference opponents that were all shitty.
A&M does add two more very tough opponents to the end of their schedule but again you are putting the cart before the horse talking about a future FSU opponent being weak*. If A&M wins their remaining big games it will boost Manziel's stock and justifiably so. Of course if they lose one RayRay99 is going to come back here and say well he lost 3 games compared to 2 last year but his stats were better so he should keep the Heisman.

*And since you brought it up, Florida's defense is still formidable despite all the injuries. The offense puts them in terrible field position often so the points allowed doesn't quite reflect it but they are still very good on that side of the ball. I have no doubt the Noles will win that game handily but how he looks against that defense will be relevant in my mind.

A&M's SoS will be significantly higher at the end of the season. Just as Winston can't help that his defense doesn't give him more opportunities, Johnny can't help that his defense couldn't keep two teams under 40 points in his losses.

Originally posted by RayRay99
I never said Winston wasn't good, he is very good. Johnny is just better.

Tebow won the Heisman when Florida went 9-4

Baylor could go undefeated and a 1 loss Oregon or Florida State would still play in the title game ahead of them. Speaking of soft schedules, Baylor hasn't played any team worth a damn at all.

Curious to see how the mud slinging against Winston goes. If Johnny would have been accused of rape it would be a topic non-stop for 3 months.

If Winston wins the Heisman...then next year he will be in the same boat.

Originally posted by RayRay99
A&M's SoS will be significantly higher at the end of the season. Just as Winston can't help that his defense doesn't give him more opportunities, Johnny can't help that his defense couldn't keep two teams under 40 points in his losses.

Like the Nike commercial..."Just One More" TD and Manziel is the hero...but he didn't have that one more...not just once...but twice...