Warrior General Games

Originally posted by omara891
Originally posted by greengoose

Originally posted by haole


I really hope that at some point, an admin or someone with actual knowledge of the game's programming can spare a minute to tell us if this idea is even possible. Like I said in a previous post, it seems like it should be an easy thing to do, simply limit roster sizes to 15 players. Is it a lot harder than that? Is there something we're missing?

The only thing I can see that might need to be accounted for is to eliminate or reduce the Special Teams energy drains - because guys playing both ways will be hard enough as it is without the ST penalty on top of it.

I'm trying to picture the development of a player if they didn't do this, and it would be kinda agonizing until the guy gets into the mid 20's or higher. Guys would be exhausted by the middle of the 1st quarter even if they poured SP's into Stamina and put all their equipment there too.

I like the idea, just would need to find the balance between energy and actually being able to build players capable of doing something other than just being Stamina junkies.

that will just become part of the strategy

yep, everyone would be in the same situation. Really makes energy settings a huge part of the game. do you stay fresh by frequent subbing or play the studs til they drop.

Originally posted by Guppy, Inc
Originally posted by omara891

Originally posted by greengoose


Originally posted by haole



I really hope that at some point, an admin or someone with actual knowledge of the game's programming can spare a minute to tell us if this idea is even possible. Like I said in a previous post, it seems like it should be an easy thing to do, simply limit roster sizes to 15 players. Is it a lot harder than that? Is there something we're missing?

The only thing I can see that might need to be accounted for is to eliminate or reduce the Special Teams energy drains - because guys playing both ways will be hard enough as it is without the ST penalty on top of it.

I'm trying to picture the development of a player if they didn't do this, and it would be kinda agonizing until the guy gets into the mid 20's or higher. Guys would be exhausted by the middle of the 1st quarter even if they poured SP's into Stamina and put all their equipment there too.

I like the idea, just would need to find the balance between energy and actually being able to build players capable of doing something other than just being Stamina junkies.

that will just become part of the strategy

yep, everyone would be in the same situation. Really makes energy settings a huge part of the game. do you stay fresh by frequent subbing or play the studs til they drop.


That's one hugely interesting aspect of the game. Just think--we might see our FIRST player ever built to reach 100 in stamina!!!

Originally posted by Larry Roadgrader
Originally posted by Guppy, Inc

Originally posted by omara891


Originally posted by greengoose



Originally posted by haole




I really hope that at some point, an admin or someone with actual knowledge of the game's programming can spare a minute to tell us if this idea is even possible. Like I said in a previous post, it seems like it should be an easy thing to do, simply limit roster sizes to 15 players. Is it a lot harder than that? Is there something we're missing?

The only thing I can see that might need to be accounted for is to eliminate or reduce the Special Teams energy drains - because guys playing both ways will be hard enough as it is without the ST penalty on top of it.

I'm trying to picture the development of a player if they didn't do this, and it would be kinda agonizing until the guy gets into the mid 20's or higher. Guys would be exhausted by the middle of the 1st quarter even if they poured SP's into Stamina and put all their equipment there too.

I like the idea, just would need to find the balance between energy and actually being able to build players capable of doing something other than just being Stamina junkies.

that will just become part of the strategy

yep, everyone would be in the same situation. Really makes energy settings a huge part of the game. do you stay fresh by frequent subbing or play the studs til they drop.


That's one hugely interesting aspect of the game. Just think--we might see our FIRST player ever built to reach 100 in stamina!!!


IF this idea ever gets anywhere beyond the suggestion thread

I'm not knocking the idea, but what strategy is it when everyone is pumping Stamina so they can stay on the field - yet don't have any abilities to go with the Stamina?

Thats not strategy - thats an entire league of cookie-cutter builds in the developmental seasons of that type of league.

I think it's safe to say that maybe there needs to be a sliding scale on stamina drain for an Ironman, one that reduces it's effects at the lowest levels and slowly brings them back in line with the mainstream by the time they hit the mid 20's (start of 3rd season on average).

A bunch of players running around with red 10's in the 2nd quarter - thats not strategy thats watching paint dry.

I don't think pumping stamina and nothing else would be an effective strategy

If this league ever gets created, and if everyone starts at the same leveled playing field with newly created players for this league, stamina is the same issue for everyone, as are the OOP penalties, as are the tough choices on SP placement and skills.

I don't think this gets off the ground without at least an initial reduction in stamina drains to at least allow players to develop - otherwise entire seasons will be guys playing each other with 10 energy for 3/4ths of the game and it will be a stalemate at that point.

Nobody punts - because nobody has any energy to kick'
Nobody tries FG's
Nobody throws - because throwing doesn't work at low levels to begin with let alone trying to throw with no energy

Get what I'm saying here - at the lower levels the player will need at least some help to make games anything close to meaningful. Later on when they get energy stores up it won't be so bad but initially there will be no gameplanning whatsoever because the players won't be able to execute it.

surprised this isn't in epic yet.

yeah, there's some technical issue to be worked out, but Bort would know more about how to do that with the current game code than most anyone else. Roster sizes, stam tweaks, probably a couple others we haven't thought of yet... but there's not much point debating on any of that until Bort says he'd be interested in hearing about the project and that it could be workable.

Send this to Epic, and get Bort's input

Originally posted by greengoose
I don't think this gets off the ground without at least an initial reduction in stamina drains to at least allow players to develop - otherwise entire seasons will be guys playing each other with 10 energy for 3/4ths of the game and it will be a stalemate at that point.

Nobody punts - because nobody has any energy to kick'
Nobody tries FG's
Nobody throws - because throwing doesn't work at low levels to begin with let alone trying to throw with no energy

Get what I'm saying here - at the lower levels the player will need at least some help to make games anything close to meaningful. Later on when they get energy stores up it won't be so bad but initially there will be no gameplanning whatsoever because the players won't be able to execute it.


So in other words it would be just like current level 1 leagues ...

I say just give us a league with a roster max size of 15 and let us work out the issues

I think this idea is fairly refined, just don't let it die and hope someone important notices

Great Idea

Originally posted by Cmfix64
I think this idea is fairly refined, just don't let it die and hope someone important notices

Thanks! I'll keep plugging away at it

Originally posted by greengoose
I don't think this gets off the ground without at least an initial reduction in stamina drains to at least allow players to develop - otherwise entire seasons will be guys playing each other with 10 energy for 3/4ths of the game and it will be a stalemate at that point.

Nobody punts - because nobody has any energy to kick'
Nobody tries FG's
Nobody throws - because throwing doesn't work at low levels to begin with let alone trying to throw with no energy

Get what I'm saying here - at the lower levels the player will need at least some help to make games anything close to meaningful. Later on when they get energy stores up it won't be so bad but initially there will be no gameplanning whatsoever because the players won't be able to execute it.


if everyone is tired, then it would be like any peewee game. I would think a punter/kicker would be a necessity to have on the team. One of my Pr/KR has ended nearly every game for 3 seasons with 10 energy yet was still getting TDs even late in games. For 2 seasons, he was PR/KR/CB2/WR5. Poor guy never got any rest yet still earned 2 or 3 return trophies from those teams. From this experience, I think the any worry about stamina is greatly exaggerated.

Originally posted by Guppy, Inc


if everyone is tired, then it would be like any peewee game. I would think a punter/kicker would be a necessity to have on the team. One of my Pr/KR has ended nearly every game for 3 seasons with 10 energy yet was still getting TDs even late in games. For 2 seasons, he was PR/KR/CB2/WR5. Poor guy never got any rest yet still earned 2 or 3 return trophies from those teams. From this experience, I think the any worry about stamina is greatly exaggerated.

I agree with this... stamina will have an affect but not as great as what people are claiming

PeeWee games are all about rotating players out and managing Energy drain - the very thing Ironman makes virtually impossible by design. It wouldn't be "just any PeeWee game" because in PeeWee the players are actually investing heavily in skills and not Stamina - so when they are out there they can actually do things. Won't have that luxury in Ironman at the PeeWee levels - there is no rotation, no way to "manage" energy except for pumping Stamina at the cost of your other skills.

Say what you will, but the lower levels of Ironman without some modification to energy drain will be like watching snails crawl on salt - it will be just as painful to watch as it is for the snail.

Anybody that has seen their veteran players with 40 Stamina get drained to 10 whenever they play a gutjob (and these guys are sitting resting for half the game) knows what I'm talking about - and Ironman will be having players not only play both ways but also have to cover those Special Teams plays too.

Originally posted by greengoose
PeeWee games are all about rotating players out and managing Energy drain - the very thing Ironman makes virtually impossible by design. It wouldn't be "just any PeeWee game" because in PeeWee the players are actually investing heavily in skills and not Stamina - so when they are out there they can actually do things. Won't have that luxury in Ironman at the PeeWee levels - there is no rotation, no way to "manage" energy except for pumping Stamina at the cost of your other skills.

Say what you will, but the lower levels of Ironman without some modification to energy drain will be like watching snails crawl on salt - it will be just as painful to watch as it is for the snail.

Anybody that has seen their veteran players with 40 Stamina get drained to 10 whenever they play a gutjob (and these guys are sitting resting for half the game) knows what I'm talking about - and Ironman will be having players not only play both ways but also have to cover those Special Teams plays too.

Against other players who are just as tired. I think it all evens out