Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Ballbright


Again, let's go back to the facts.

1. Billy gutted a team without the owner's permission.
2. Billy gave teams he was on special deals (non free market) for players.
3. Billy stripped one team of its players with the intent, in some cases, of bettering teams he was on (COLLUSION).







Exactly.

Originally posted by PS3
Originally posted by Alex Wondertramp

Originally posted by HaplosDog


Originally posted by Alex Wondertramp



just caught this thread...without reading everyones responses...doesnt suprise me a bit...all the cockiness covers up all the skullduggery...and also why no mention of this in the city if champions update...sounds like reportable news to me...

That is uncalled for. The last City of Champions Update was posted long before any of this happened. I'm honestly disappointed in you for stating an opinion without having read any of the evidence.


well...i have read all the "evidence" and i want to add i am not a lawyer, but i did stay at a holiday inn about two weeks ago in san jose...and for the most part what the original poster said really hasnt been disproven...youve tried to discredit him and then wrangle on details...whatever....the bandits pretty much got something for nothing and the man that set it forward is the infamous billyvassi because of his role on the other team....was it right ot wrong? it was wrong, but not against the rules...unfortunately this is a beta and people would rather game the system then compete honorably...no one here is really suprised...they act like douchbags in the forums...and they act like douchbags in the locker room...and they compete like douchbags...in the end it doesnt matter...i just find it funny that they would need to upgrade the "deepest" cb corps in the league and put themselves at risk for doing it...they did it out of fear of the Real Champions in Brisbane and other Zeta teams that they could be facing if they make the finals...and haplos dont get your panties in a bunch...the comment was unecessary...but the thread i read before this was my city of champions...and i thought that this should have been in it...

Exactly, the owner of the team just posted PARTIAL PMs that were twisted to make the OP look back. That's not just a bit suspicious too.

NOTHING the OP brought up has been disproven because that's what happened. A team the GM was on traded a needed player for virtually nothing to a team that another one of his players was on which just happened to need a #4 CB for their playoff run. One team got gutted and the other unfairly benefited. That's pretty much collusion.






By that logic, as Billy was gutting the team, every single team that traded with Billy was "colluding". I don't believe that to be true.

I'll say it before, and I'll say it again, and I'll keep saying it until people get it:

Collusion requires more than one person. Arguably, Billy illegally gutted a team, and in doing so, made other teams that he was on better. However, unless you can prove that the owners of the teams that traded in the firesale KNEW that Billy's goal was to better one team by way of an illegal gutting, there is NO COLLUSION.

Catspaw IS just as guilty of collusion.

He received an offer of a known need player for a known INACTIVE from a guy on his team, and just said yes by accident? He didn't think hmmm..this is really stripping the other team of a resource and benefiting my team (the definition of collusion)?

There are only two options here...he knew what was going on, or he is a complete idiot.

Nowhere on this thread has catspaw denied he knew anything about what was going on.

Billy said that he PM'd him about the trade, meaning that he told Catspaw, meaning he knew.

They both are guilty. Catspaw knew that Billy knew the HB was inactive. He knew he was colluding.

Originally posted by bigpimpin123
Originally posted by drifter



His first post was rational. When he was banned from the forum for it, he instantly resorted to getting into a pissing contest and making threats. If he had said, "Wait a minute, I didn't mean anything by posting it in the public forum" it would have blown over. He chose not to use that tactic.



May 21st, about 30-45 minutes after forum post by JoeMalaka - JoeMalaka is banned from the Brisbane Bandits forum. No PM from CatsPaw27 on why. JoeMalaka figures it was because of the post. JoeMalaka writes CatsPaw27 explaining why he did it and apologized if he was too far. CatsPaw27 responded pissed off, telling JoeMalaka he was wrong, and stating JoeMalaka (player is Mojo Dojo) is removed from the FB depth chart and will be special teams only. JoeMalaka gets in 6 plays only in following game the same day (about 45 minutes later).


says here that he didnt get pissed right away


Exactly. My first response (I had to respond asking why banned...didn't get PM'ed saying why) wasn't an attack at all.

I have offered Drifter, a player on Brisbane and respected GLB'er, the right to log into my account and view these PM's. Catspaw needs to approve publicly, though.

Originally posted by PS3

Post the PMs publically, I give them permission to. I asked them for info about the gutting and some suspicious stuff came up. And I'm sure them being in contact with you still isn't suspicious even though they were RANDOM people you traded for right? So why would they keep in contact with you? They were just RANDOM trades right?


They were people who were left behind, not people who were traded for. They PMed me and said mods were investigating, I asked who (wanted to PM them and explain my side) and they said PS3.

I said I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and that's what I'll do

Originally posted by Ballbright

No, you are missing the point entirely. And omitting that the HB WAS INACTIVE ALL SEASON. He wasn't "lvl12" he was a freaking inactive, a third HB was a necessity and hey got one to replace the inactive....

We got a third RB like 5 games ago. We have Nagurski (lvl 16), Poindexter (lvl 12), and Berris (lvl 12)

Originally posted by
As far as your firesale/conspiracy nonsense you're missing the point entirely. I'm not suggesting a "conspiracy theory" of any sort, but good choice of terms to try an discredit the truth by making someone appear less than sane.

Again, let's go back to the facts.

1. Billy gutted a team without the owner's permission.
2. Billy gave teams he was on special deals (non free market) for players.
3. Billy stripped one team of its players with the intent, in some cases, of bettering teams he was on (COLLUSION).


You've established that billy did some questionable things, but not the Bandits. 30+ teams benefited from his actions, but you are alleging far more than that:

Originally posted by Ballbright
Yeah, after the original billyvassi controversy I did some research and saw that they had acquired players from that team. While I had originally tried to defend Billy, I am now of the opinion that he does need to be suspended/banned for collusion, as well as any team owner he colluded with.

If he were truly just trying to "do the right thing" as he had claimed in the original thread, he wouldn't have dealt players to teams he was on.

I used to respect the Bandits as a team (even if I think many of their team members are idiots), but after this stunt, which I firmly believe to be entirely dishonest, that throws any former respect I had out the window.

The Bandit's team should agree to release the players as immediately as possible, and recuse themselves from any post season activities.

Billyvassi: I am ashamed at having attempted to defend you in the original thread.

Bandits team (management): You have cast a pall over an otherwise clean league, and brought shame and disgrace to the Oceania league.

Originally posted by Ballbright
Catspaw IS just as guilty of collusion.

He received an offer of a known need player for a known INACTIVE from a guy on his team, and just said yes by accident? He didn't think hmmm..this is really stripping the other team of a resource and benefiting my team (the definition of collusion)?

There are only two options here...he knew what was going on, or he is a complete idiot.

Nowhere on this thread has catspaw denied he knew anything about what was going on.

Billy said that he PM'd him about the trade, meaning that he told catspaw, meaning he knew.

You both are guilty. Catspaw knew that Billy knew the HB was inactive. He knew he was colluding.



I'll admit that now you're closer, but that's still circumstantial. What you've proven is that Catspaw is guilty of being an opportunistic Owner, but still no collusion.

Unless the PM from Billy to Catspaw said, "Cats... I'm gutting this team. Want this CB?" then it's not collusion.

Yes, Methomps I still believe the Bandit's management (Catspaw) has cast a pall over an otherwise clean league, and brought shame and disgrace to the Oceania league.

..and I have lost any respect I have for their team for not holding Catspaw and Billy accountable for their, obvious to everyone else in the world, actions. In fact, it seems early in this thread the Bandit's team was hell bent on trying to discredit JOE for doing just that, holding them accountable.

I no longer respect them as a team.

Anything else you would like to put in bold?

Originally posted by atm490
Originally posted by Ballbright

Catspaw IS just as guilty of collusion.

He received an offer of a known need player for a known INACTIVE from a guy on his team, and just said yes by accident? He didn't think hmmm..this is really stripping the other team of a resource and benefiting my team (the definition of collusion)?

There are only two options here...he knew what was going on, or he is a complete idiot.

Nowhere on this thread has catspaw denied he knew anything about what was going on.

Billy said that he PM'd him about the trade, meaning that he told catspaw, meaning he knew.

You both are guilty. Catspaw knew that Billy knew the HB was inactive. He knew he was colluding.



I'll admit that now you're closer, but that's still circumstantial. What you've proven is that Catspaw is guilty of being an opportunistic Owner, but still no collusion.

Unless the PM from Billy to Catspaw said, "Cats... I'm gutting this team. Want this CB?" then it's not collusion.


But what if catspaw knew what was happening? The guy is smart enough to know that if a GM of a team (not owner) that is on one of his team is offering a CB (that they need, because catspaw said they needed it) for an inactive...he knew what was going on. He is smart enough.

Catspaw on this thread said he is honorable. Is it honorable to give a team an inactive player for an active player, knowing the team getting the inactive will be hurt by it? Where is the honor in that?

Good thing no one gives a crap what you think.

Want to put that in bold?

Originally posted by atm490
Originally posted by Ballbright

Catspaw IS just as guilty of collusion.

He received an offer of a known need player for a known INACTIVE from a guy on his team, and just said yes by accident? He didn't think hmmm..this is really stripping the other team of a resource and benefiting my team (the definition of collusion)?

There are only two options here...he knew what was going on, or he is a complete idiot.

Nowhere on this thread has catspaw denied he knew anything about what was going on.

Billy said that he PM'd him about the trade, meaning that he told catspaw, meaning he knew.

You both are guilty. Catspaw knew that Billy knew the HB was inactive. He knew he was colluding.



I'll admit that now you're closer, but that's still circumstantial. What you've proven is that Catspaw is guilty of being an opportunistic Owner, but still no collusion.

Unless the PM from Billy to Catspaw said, "Cats... I'm gutting this team. Want this CB?" then it's not collusion.


He was offered a trade for an INACTIVE PLAYER. Catspaw knows that no team would trade a starting CB for an inactive player no matter what the level. And he got a pm from billy before so im sure he had some idea of what was going on

Originally posted by atm490
I'll admit that now you're closer, but that's still circumstantial. What you've proven is that Catspaw is guilty of being an opportunistic Owner, but still no collusion.

Unless the PM from Billy to Catspaw said, "Cats... I'm gutting this team. Want this CB?" then it's not collusion.


No, you don't have to be gutting to be colluding. Just stripping a team of its resources. If billy made one trade only and it was the trade to the bandits it would still be colluding.

He was removing a resource from the Thrashers with the sole benefit (in that instance) of bettering the Bandits. That trade did nothing for the Thrashers, and was solely designed to benefit a team Billy was on.

If you think Catspaw had no knowledge that he was trading a non resource for a good player...then I highly doubt you make any money being a lawyer...

Originally posted by civarian
Originally posted by HaplosDog

Originally posted by civarian


seriously, it took me forever to read this thread. i would pay money for everyone to sit on their hands for five minutes so i could absorb it.

what is it that you wish to accomplish? and i mean specifically, the main contributors in this thread, what do you think is going to come of this very public, and imo very juvenile and nasty airing of your dirty laundry? joe? billy? cats? ball?

because this devolved into a pissing contest ten pages ago, and nothing is being accomplished. so if there is some solution to be had, lets hear it.





maybe if they would stop being so defensive and take responsibility, everyone would

Originally posted by kevins4484
Good thing no one gives a crap what you think.

Want to put that in bold?



Apparently you do, enough to respond bitterly anyway...