Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Azure Dreams
Despite the fact taht Deathblade's analogy in no way failed, I sitll +1 this thread. If someone has done something bad enough to be kicked out of the game, then they're gone. If they're still allowed to participate int he game and have just been banned (regardless of length of time) from the forum, then I support their ability to post in private forums.

My feeling is regardless of but heavily backed by the fact that bans are very subjective and not always warranted.

lol i appreciate the +1, but if you think dblade's analogy didnt fail you just said that you would be mad at the internet company for turning off someones internet for not paying the bills, because they couldn't access your forum. See how little sense that makes when its not even backed up by forum rules? You know your course of action will result in loss of internet when you fail to pay your bills at least. its a direct 1:1 correlation. But expecting a ban for actions in public forums to result in loss of access to premium, private forums which a moderator has no power in doesnt really make sense.

/me is sad you brought up dblade's analogy.

Originally posted by oldskool
Originally posted by turnerhero

Then what do you define as a forum ban?

I define it as when someone cannot post in the forums anywhere, ever.

So I mean...the argumetn is already flawed...HOWEVER...

I would go along with the 100 Flex spent, if the person has any private forums of their own, to be refunded, and their PF be removed.

lol, you're so lost.
forum banned people can still post in team forums for any teams they own, GM or have players on. Maybe team forums they're invited to, I'm not 100% on it.
they cannot post in public forums, or private forums they do not own even if the person who owns that forum invites them to it, which is why we have the argument.

afaik, it is any team forum to which they have access.

Originally posted by Jose Bagg

But the suggestion is "They stop punishing customers". Telling me they do punish customers is not a rebuttal to the suggestion that they stop doing it.

They should punish people that break the rules. It gives an incentive for other people to not break them.

As for the owner of a PF being punished because someone is banned, that's pretty bogus. They should be mad at the person who was banned, not at the person who banned them.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Jose Bagg


But the suggestion is "They stop punishing customers". Telling me they do punish customers is not a rebuttal to the suggestion that they stop doing it.

They should punish people that break the rules. It gives an incentive for other people to not break them.

As for the owner of a PF being punished because someone is banned, that's pretty bogus. They should be mad at the person who was banned, not at the person who banned them.

So is it your Modus Operandi to go around and just say that the opposite of suggestions should be the norm? I find it curious that I made a nice challenge at the top of page 11 that nobody has accepted.

Originally posted by Jose Bagg


Bort and DD can punish customers. A business can refuse to serve you if you have been causing a problem in their establishment. That is a form of punishment.

It is not YOUR private forum. It is a private forum that GLB is currently loaning to you.

Can you have people that are not members of this game post in that forum? Can you take that forum with you? To me that means it is not "Yours" but merely on loan from GLB.

But the suggestion is "They stop punishing customers". Telling me they do punish customers is not a rebuttal to the suggestion that they stop doing it.



That's fine. Then I can disagree with your suggestion in this way.

I disagree that they should still be allowed to post in private forums due to the fact that it does not become a deterrent to those who would attempt to disrupt the integrity of the public forums, if they can go back to the private forums and continue on as if nothing happened.

By allowing access to any forum besides the public forums, you have in fact taken away GLB's ability to protect it's other paying customers.

Originally posted by WearyWarrior
Originally posted by Azure Dreams

Despite the fact taht Deathblade's analogy in no way failed, I sitll +1 this thread. If someone has done something bad enough to be kicked out of the game, then they're gone. If they're still allowed to participate int he game and have just been banned (regardless of length of time) from the forum, then I support their ability to post in private forums.

My feeling is regardless of but heavily backed by the fact that bans are very subjective and not always warranted.

lol i appreciate the +1, but if you think dblade's analogy didnt fail you just said that you would be mad at the internet company for turning off someones internet for not paying the bills, because they couldn't access your forum. See how little sense that makes when its not even backed up by forum rules? You know your course of action will result in loss of internet when you fail to pay your bills at least. its a direct 1:1 correlation. But expecting a ban for actions in public forums to result in loss of access to premium, private forums which a moderator has no power in doesnt really make sense.

/me is sad you brought up dblade's analogy.

The differences mainly sit in the fact that 1) the internet company doesn't run these forums as well and 2) paying your bill or noot is much more cut and dry than whether you deserve to be banned.

Other than that, it's a valid comparison. Your argument against it is that you don't expect to lose private forum access when you break the rules and get banned. Ignoring the fact that this shows ignorance on your part and the fact that you should probably know the situation before you get yourself into it, the problem there is if that is your complain, then adding to the forum rules or any other announcement a note that says "If you get a forum ban then it extends to private forums" would resolve your issue just as well as changing the fact of whether you get banned from private forums. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that would sate your desire.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Jose Bagg


But the suggestion is "They stop punishing customers". Telling me they do punish customers is not a rebuttal to the suggestion that they stop doing it.

They should punish people that break the rules. It gives an incentive for other people to not break them.

As for the owner of a PF being punished because someone is banned, that's pretty bogus. They should be mad at the person who was banned, not at the person who banned them.

Having your access to public forums revoked is a punishment. In fact, I'd wager that it's a more fitting punishment.

Originally posted by Jose Bagg


Can you post a reason that banned players should not be allowed in my private forum that does not rely on what Bort and DD deem, or what you believe are Bort and DDs rights? Can you post an argument that is based in business sense and generally accepted wisdom?

I'll take this one...

This is a game co-owned by two individuals; Bort and DD. What they want to do with their game is the law here. That's pretty much all there is to it.

Originally posted by JDaniels127
By allowing access to any forum besides the public forums, you have in fact taken away GLB's ability to protect it's other paying customers.

You cannot be serious. The fact that I want to talk to somebody in my forum without spending 1000 FP to buy a team I don't want just to get a forum they can post in....THAT takes away GLB's ability to protect paying customers? HOW? Honestly, tell me how.

How bad is GLB going to get because JimBob von Douchebag gets to post in oldskool's private forum that cost 100 FP, as opposed to JBvD posting in oldskool's new team forum (that won't be competitive, lol, hope you like 255-0) that cost 1000 FP?

Originally posted by Azure Dreams

Having your access to public forums revoked is a punishment. In fact, I'd wager that it's a more fitting punishment.

Possibly. That would be a valid argument.

However, I think that the more harsher the punishment is, the less likely people are going to willingly break rules. For example, look at the deal with multi accounts. Nothing is ever done...the multi account is banned but the main account is untouched, regardless of them breaking the multi-account rule, and probably breaking many rules with the multi account. Do people fear making multis to spam crap? Nope. If the main accounts were banned for a month, would people think twice before making multis to spam? I'd say it is pretty likely.

Originally posted by JDaniels127
Originally posted by Jose Bagg



Bort and DD can punish customers. A business can refuse to serve you if you have been causing a problem in their establishment. That is a form of punishment.

It is not YOUR private forum. It is a private forum that GLB is currently loaning to you.

Can you have people that are not members of this game post in that forum? Can you take that forum with you? To me that means it is not "Yours" but merely on loan from GLB.

But the suggestion is "They stop punishing customers". Telling me they do punish customers is not a rebuttal to the suggestion that they stop doing it.



That's fine. Then I can disagree with your suggestion in this way.

I disagree that they should still be allowed to post in private forums due to the fact that it does not become a deterrent to those who would attempt to disrupt the integrity of the public forums, if they can go back to the private forums and continue on as if nothing happened.

By allowing access to any forum besides the public forums, you have in fact taken away GLB's ability to protect it's other paying customers.



A great thought. I would counter that those people who don't want to make trouble won't. Those that do want to make trouble will. Whether you ban someone or not will not deter future bad behavior of those with ill wills. If you think a player should not be allowed in the public forums for the good of the public, then so be it. Allowing them to post in a private forum does not change the fact that they cannot affect the public well being.

Originally posted by turnerhero
Originally posted by Jose Bagg



Can you post a reason that banned players should not be allowed in my private forum that does not rely on what Bort and DD deem, or what you believe are Bort and DDs rights? Can you post an argument that is based in business sense and generally accepted wisdom?

I'll take this one...

This is a game co-owned by two individuals; Bort and DD. What they want to do with their game is the law here. That's pretty much all there is to it.

You are really awful. This does not in any way answer the question. This reiterates "THEYRE ALLOWED TO DO IT IF THEY WANT 2!!"

No one is questioning their right. What is being questioned is their reason. It isn't smart to do things without valid reason.

Originally posted by Azure Dreams
Originally posted by WearyWarrior

Originally posted by Azure Dreams


Despite the fact taht Deathblade's analogy in no way failed, I sitll +1 this thread. If someone has done something bad enough to be kicked out of the game, then they're gone. If they're still allowed to participate int he game and have just been banned (regardless of length of time) from the forum, then I support their ability to post in private forums.

My feeling is regardless of but heavily backed by the fact that bans are very subjective and not always warranted.

lol i appreciate the +1, but if you think dblade's analogy didnt fail you just said that you would be mad at the internet company for turning off someones internet for not paying the bills, because they couldn't access your forum. See how little sense that makes when its not even backed up by forum rules? You know your course of action will result in loss of internet when you fail to pay your bills at least. its a direct 1:1 correlation. But expecting a ban for actions in public forums to result in loss of access to premium, private forums which a moderator has no power in doesnt really make sense.

/me is sad you brought up dblade's analogy.

The differences mainly sit in the fact that 1) the internet company doesn't run these forums as well and 2) paying your bill or noot is much more cut and dry than whether you deserve to be banned.

Other than that, it's a valid comparison. Your argument against it is that you don't expect to lose private forum access when you break the rules and get banned. Ignoring the fact that this shows ignorance on your part and the fact that you should probably know the situation before you get yourself into it, the problem there is if that is your complain, then adding to the forum rules or any other announcement a note that says "If you get a forum ban then it extends to private forums" would resolve your issue just as well as changing the fact of whether you get banned from private forums. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that would sate your desire.



If that was their decision I would have to be satisfied i suppose. I have 2 grounds to stand on in my suggestion I feel.

A) I paid for the forum, and as such i should be permitted to select who may use it. They cannot use it to disrupt the general user base, so the effect of their forum suspension is retained.

B) Rules covering this are absent from the Forum Rules. Consistency with the rest of their policy of allowing access to ones own private forums and team forums which i still maintain are essentially private forums given to an owner, they should be able to use Private Forums of other users.

An addition to the rules would remove a good bit of my stance making my chances of getting a change in the way things are a good bit tougher on me.

I wont deny that my original complaint that I was being punished was a little shoddy but no more so than the counter analogy really. Simply by the fact that an analogy should work 1:1 and here you are basically siding with my idea, yet i would guess you still would find getting angry with the ISP pretty silly.

Valid reason to Bort and DD may be defined differently than it is to you, or someone else...

The fact is, they can say tomorrow that everyone is required to upload a headshot of themselves because Bort no longer will tolerate long hair, and anyone with long hair in their picture will be automatically perma-banned from the game forever.

They will have mass quantities of people quit, leave, and otherwise bitch, but that doesn't mean they have to explain themselves.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Azure Dreams


Having your access to public forums revoked is a punishment. In fact, I'd wager that it's a more fitting punishment.

Possibly. That would be a valid argument.

However, I think that the more harsher the punishment is, the less likely people are going to willingly break rules. For example, look at the deal with multi accounts. Nothing is ever done...the multi account is banned but the main account is untouched, regardless of them breaking the multi-account rule, and probably breaking many rules with the multi account. Do people fear making multis to spam crap? Nope. If the main accounts were banned for a month, would people think twice before making multis to spam? I'd say it is pretty likely.

Now, this one is a poor analogy.

1. Both accounts in a multi-account situation are involved. Punishing both isn't unreasonable as such, by the same logic as the forum example.

2. Regardless of the above, the multi issue actually breaks the law set forth to steal money from Bort. Posting in a private forum does no such thing.

3. Actually, it isn't uncommon for multi-account-users to be banned altogether. They just never bother to put any serious effort into locating them.