Warrior General Games

Seems like it would be an awesome way to help newer OCs be capable?

The OAI would use "Scout Tool" query results to select plays to fill packages for each opponent.

It would be ideal that this could be done at any time with the press of a button for any team, but would be understandable if that was limited in some way.

The OC would have to still do all the work of using the progressions though. Seems kinda useless.

This is a horrible, horrible idea, and anyone who used it would lose quite a few games.

Looking at nothing but the bare numbers on the scout tool is a great way to get tricked into using a play that got lucky one time for a 99-yard touchdown but got stuffed for 1-yard losses 9 other times. Scout Tool would look at that, see it has an average of 9 yards per play, and would set up the AI to spam the hell out of it.

It would also miss opportunities for great plays that have poor averages for an odd reason. For example, a team that has a defensive play that triple-covers the TE and single covers the WRs. If a prior opponent had a game where they stubbornly kept throwing it to the triple-covered TE, that would drive down the average yardage of that play... even though a smarter OC would look at a situation like that and find success by throwing bombs to the single-covered WRs all day long. But the Scout Tool would skip that play just because it has a low per-play average yardage.

There is no substitute for just watching replays of your opponent's defensive plays and looking for weaknesses. The Scout Tool has its uses, but the numbers alone are meaningless unless you understand how those numbers came to be.

-1

Well I think he just means that it would take the top plays and fill them into the packages and the OC would go from there?

But:

1 - OC packages work quite a bit differently from OC to OC.
2 - Seeing a successful play without knowing its progressions is a bit useless.
3 - It seems unnecessary to go to the lengths of setting that up when it would still result in a lot of work otherwise.

OMG, Horrible suggestion. If you don't like doing the coordinating, just quit. No way in hell could any Admin/Dev at GLB even set something like this up to be reliable at all. Do the work yourself and shine bright like a diamond in the sky.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpKyPS1Qeqs

I wouldn't use this, but I'm pretty sure this would do better than any of the current default oais...

I don't think it will be particularly stellar, and yes progressions make a big deal, but that doesn't change that a somewhat guided approach probably beats a completely unguided one.

Yes it may add doomed plays, but it may also add a play that is very open...

The packages could be set to very high auto adjust by default to contribute to good play-call behavior based on such narrow scouting.

+1

great suggestion

Originally posted by Burger Kang
I wouldn't use this, but I'm pretty sure this would do better than any of the current default oais...

I don't think it will be particularly stellar, and yes progressions make a big deal, but that doesn't change that a somewhat guided approach probably beats a completely unguided one.

Yes it may add doomed plays, but it may also add a play that is very open...

The packages could be set to very high auto adjust by default to contribute to good play-call behavior based on such narrow scouting.

Except it wouldn't be remotely accurate and thus hurt them more than help them. It would be different under a casual circumstance but under current regular OAI's this would be a nightmare.

It is much like the auto tag suggestion. Good in thought but terrible when you really think about it because is only going to do more bad than good for a new coordinator.

-1 horrible idea

If you can't coord quit then.

+1

I actually think this could be the solution to a lot of coordinating headaches and it could be the entry point for the old 'intermediate' AI ideas that Bort floated around (this is years ago). You'd still have full customization for those who want it, but if you could create a tool that populated a preset AI based on scouting results I think you'd really have something great for the game.

Simple statistics can take care of this. Bort would just need a simple algorithm for determining the 'best' plays for each input situation:
Originally posted by Novus
Looking at nothing but the bare numbers on the scout tool is a great way to get tricked into using a play that got lucky one time for a 99-yard touchdown but got stuffed for 1-yard losses 9 other times. Scout Tool would look at that, see it has an average of 9 yards per play, and would set up the AI to spam the hell out of it.

I think Bort could get around this with some logic surrounding which receivers were getting the targets. Realistically, if this is an 'intermediate' option, it's not the worst thing in the world if it just uses the defaults. I know that's less than ideal, but that gives an advantage to using the full customized AI.
Originally posted by bhall
The OC would have to still do all the work of using the progressions though. Seems kinda useless.

What they really need is a DAI scout tool. A more in depth to break down plays by RQB, QB. All the different HBs and FBs and TEs

Click a box to to select what you are looking for. This would be awesome.

There are ways to set up the AI that would maximize the effectiveness of this narrow scouting information.

Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust

I think Bort could get around this with some logic surrounding which receivers were getting the targets. Realistically, if this is an 'intermediate' option, it's not the worst thing in the world if it just uses the defaults. I know that's less than ideal, but that gives an advantage to using the full customized AI.
Originally posted by bhall

The OC would have to still do all the work of using the progressions though. Seems kinda useless.


I dunno, I would have to see how far they were willing to go with it. Progressions are sometimes a fine art and they would probably ensure that every target is used thus making play calls that might be effective for someone using the right progressions to be absolutely awful having all targets in the progression.

bhall, it isn't like any of the other default AIs use custom progressions scouted to the opponents?

The point is that you will at the very least be using the "awful" plays that have done well against your opponent as opposed to the ones that some default AI runs.

I doubt its feasible that they scout progressions for you, and I don't think its needed for it to be useful.

The OAI could be set up to favor the run and screen game, since these two should have slightly more integrity using only the scout tool function.

Are you wanting this for casual leagues?