Warrior General Games

On Side Kicks.

We need these.

I know there is a concern they would be over done or buggy some how, but my suggestion is to implement them in a way that prevents that from being the case.

Do this by making it more of a random event, the way a field goal is now (I think), and less based upon a step by step build based pathing collision check process the way normal plays and returns are done.

And then limit when they could be used.

Essentially say you have a 20% chance of succeeding with an onside kick attempt. modified with a set range by the details below.

And that onside kicks could only be selected at some point late in the game when down by so many points, say the last X minutes of the game where X = Scores Behind Times 2 minutes minus .5 minutes times Time Outs Left, or whatever makes sense.

Yes that would stink in a way, but it would be better than not having these options at all,
The chance of success would be modified slightly by the comparative ST Onside Kick Squad team qualities like this

From the Return Squad Average Blocking subtract the Coverage Squad's Average Agility. Do the same thing with the Return Squad's Average Strength and the Coverage Squads Average Strength. Add the results together. If a positive number then make a 1-100 check, if less then subtract 5% to the chance of Onside Kick Success. If negative, make a 1-100 check and if less than the absolute value of the result, then add 2% to the chance of Onside Kick Success.

Do the same thing comparing the Return team's Average Energy to the Coverage Squad's average Energy and then Morale to Morale. Add those two results togetherIf a positive number then make a 1-100 check, if less then subtract 5% to the chance of Onside Kick Success. If negative, make a 1-100 check and if less than the absolute value of the result, then add 2% to the chance of Onside Kick Success.

Randomly select a return team member and a coverage team member. The Return player does a fumble recovery check. If the first check succeeds then -5% to the Onside Kick Success chance, otherwise add 2% to the Onside Kick Success chance. Next the randomly selected coverage team player does a knock loose check against the return player. If this check succeeds then add 2% to the Onside Kick Success chance, if not then 5% is subtracted from the online kick success check.

Thus the chance of Online Kick Success could be anywhere from 0% to 28% depending on the qualities of the Onside coverage and return teams.

This is not a huge chance of success, and its only available to teams that are losing and only when losing late. So its not going to happen alot.

And being a math thing rather than a pathing thing its not going to be as succeptible to bugginess.

Does this sound like a reasonable compromise between a detailed simulation and bug fears that can get Onside Kicks into the game?

I like the idea of adding onside kicks. I'm glad you took squib kicks out, that was asking for too much at once.

This would give those of us who enjoy special teams something to exp.... um, something to play around with. Special teams have been kind of boring since they went to far with nerfing it a few seasons ago. I'm not sure if the way your way is the best way to do it, but there should be a cap on the % chance of success. Recovering your own onside kick should not happen very often.

Originally posted by spartan822
I like the idea of adding onside kicks. I'm glad you took squib kicks out, that was asking for too much at once.

This would give those of us who enjoy special teams something to exp.... um, something to play around with. Special teams have been kind of boring since they went to far with nerfing it a few seasons ago. I'm not sure if the way your way is the best way to do it, but there should be a cap on the % chance of success. Recovering your own onside kick should not happen very often.

Yeah, Squibbs also totally different thing, different solution.

I agree that this solution is not very appealing at first glance.

But it has the benefit of being probably pretty easy to code, and not leaving room for bizarre results while still considering the nature of the players used. It gets the concept in the game. Maybe down the road it could then be expanded upon in a more satisfying manner.

On which side?

lol

please no. STs are already shit, dont add any more to STs.

How would this work in casual?

I am getting rid of casual after this season so it's not really an issue.

Originally posted by Freddy Mercury
How would this work in casual?

I would suggest a setting window similar to the 2 point conversion attempt.

-1 from me it would be something that would end up being a can of worms that screwed the sim completely up. there would also be those owners that made the mistake of actually doing the onside kicks in the wrong situations or even everytime they kicked off. so this is a bad idea in my opinion.

Let's also take away deep passing. I'm concerned there will be owners that will throw deep passes in the wrong situations or every down. So that is a bad idea in my opinion.

+1 to OP.

Originally posted by hatchman
-1 from me it would be something that would end up being a can of worms that screwed the sim completely up. there would also be those owners that made the mistake of actually doing the onside kicks in the wrong situations or even everytime they kicked off. so this is a bad idea in my opinion.

You didn't read the fine print.

This would be limited to only certain situations, to wit you are losing late. If you are winning, or its not late in the game, its not even an option.

+1 to onside kicks however GLB wants to set it up (very limited, late game only)

I'd want 2 new ST's depth charts though (Onside Kick team and Hands Team (onside return)).