Warrior General Games

Hey guys

I want to build a real int. manchine, but im not whole sure about the sstats abd cap order.

I was thinking: speed -> Agility -> catching -> jumping -> Vision ?

Originally posted by simo5091
Hey guys

I want to build a real int. manchine, but im not whole sure about the sstats abd cap order.

I was thinking: speed -> Agility -> catching -> jumping -> Vision ?

speed->agility->vision->jumping->catching-> strength

77-77-77-77-68-61 then 36-40 pts of equipment in speed and the rest in agility. if you truly want an interception machine, but you are probably going to get burnt a good bit as well.

Originally posted by Rage Kinard
speed->agility->vision->jumping->catching-> strength

77-77-77-77-68-61 then 36-40 pts of equipment in speed and the rest in agility. if you truly want an interception machine, but you are probably going to get burnt a good bit as well.


what level would you be when you finish the attributes on that build? im not sure it leaves enough time for SAs. heck, im going 68/68/73/68/68 (ends at about 88/83/83/74/71) and i hardly have enough to round out the build with secondaries (strength to 61, confidence and tackling to 48 and stamina in the low/mid 50's) and SAs (5-9-9-2-8/3-6-0-0-0/8 jumping catch). perhaps the build your propose isnt quite so SA heavy?

Thanks, but should i cap speed at 68, then agility to 68 and so on?

yes. circle capping is not as good as straight capping.

thanks for advice

Originally posted by Worker 3
yes. circle capping is not as good as straight capping.

For the first attribute. However, if you are multi-training while taking attributes up, then circle capping attributes 2-4 is a very good idea.

Originally posted by Worker 3
what level would you be when you finish the attributes on that build? im not sure it leaves enough time for SAs. heck, im going 68/68/73/68/68 (ends at about 88/83/83/74/71) and i hardly have enough to round out the build with secondaries (strength to 61, confidence and tackling to 48 and stamina in the low/mid 50's) and SAs (5-9-9-2-8/3-6-0-0-0/8 jumping catch). perhaps the build your propose isnt quite so SA heavy?

part of the difference is I would be circle capping attributes 2-4 and taking advantage of multi-train with each attribute enhanced 30%.

Also, if I'm building an interception machine, I'm not touching tackling. Right now it isn't that big a deal anyway. My 67 CB was best run defender on team last season in APL and he only has 27 tackling. Also, if you are building an interception machine, you are going to have less pts in SAs. You want the WR to get separation so he is targeted, but you want high jumping to try and get the ball in front of him.

My SA tree for a build like this would look more like
5-9-9-1-1
2-4-0-0-0

Personally, I wouldn't build this type of CB, because I think it would get burnt too much. However, it would pull in the INTs.

i gotta say that advice on tackling is awful imo, but everything else from rage is pretty much right.

spin is gonna kill any CB built like that. hell, i think make tackle AEQ might be the most important EQ for CBs in coming seasons.

Originally posted by Rage Kinard

Also, if I'm building an interception machine, I'm not touching tackling. Right now it isn't that big a deal anyway. My 67 CB was best run defender on team last season in APL and he only has 27 tackling. Also, if you are building an interception machine, you are going to have less pts in SAs. You want the WR to get separation so he is targeted, but you want high jumping to try and get the ball in front of him.

My SA tree for a build like this would look more like
5-9-9-1-1
2-4-0-0-0

Personally, I wouldn't build this type of CB, because I think it would get burnt too much. However, it would pull in the INTs.

weird... back when i had a CB in USPL, he had soft capped tackling, and missed far more tackles than i would have cared for him to... and i can imagine WL is very much the same. the reason i would venture to say you perhaps didnt miss many tackles (and then assume that the CB in questions is a good run defender) is because of how strong the passing game is at present... and since so many plays are passing plays, and many WRs dont have the break tackle score to break tackles (even against low tackling CBs), and so you are left with very few broken tackles... then again, i am completely guessing a is didnt even look at your CBs game tape or have even watched much WL game tape, so this could be a very wrong assumption although in the future, i am assuming this will change very much as we will start to see WRs with much much much more strength, and HB builds will be even better than they are now... to the point that i think i may even start to agree with whatje said above that perhaps CBs should start looking at make tackle % pieces.

i would also disagree with your rational pertaining to SAs. i wouldnt say INTs need less SAs or should have more SAs, but should have roughly the same amount. a cover CB needs the cookie cutter CB SAs of SB, SV, SDC and CD... but a INT CB will probably have CD, SV, SH, and SDC (i dont see why you dont include this in your tree... it provides an albeit small speed boost if nothing else, and will give you more of a safety net with a bonus to your PD score in case you miss the INT roll.), and will also maybe have jumping catch or some other "catching" SA (although i doubt any other one would be work as well as jumping catch... assuming JC even works). if you dont want an additional SA to help with INTs, then you can just add another cap in speed.

i do agree however with your assertion that in order to get picks, you want the WR to get separation... but im not sure i agree with you on how one can successfully do that. you dont need to be slow and let BH take care of it... you can just play off and aggressive and let the initial cushion help you. the WR will start off with a good amount of separation, and will maintain that on short and intermediate routes. this is good for 2 reasons... 1. it gives you opportunities for picks, and 2. if you miss on a short or intermediate route, there will often or at least sometimes be someone else that can make the tackle. on deep routes, the cushion will help you not get burnt so bad.

the majority of successful passing teams in Pro and higher have at least one WR that is built to break tackles and does it effectively. the vast majority, i would say.

on top of that, some of the best receivers are tackle-breaking receivers because they make one CB look stupid trying to bring them down and have a lot of open space to run.

i totally expect the number and effectiveness of these type of receivers to go up, and based on how people keep talking about building their corners in this forum and others -- there seem to be very few people who are either a) aware of this or b) ready to deal with it with their prospective builds. instead, most CB builders seem to be looking toward middling strength/tackling and slightly increased speed.

should be interesting to see, and that's my rationale behind thinking MT% is going to be hugely valuable, and why Rage's argument that CBs don't need tackling is going to be problematic moving forward :\

Originally posted by whatje
the majority of successful passing teams in Pro and higher have at least one WR that is built to break tackles and does it effectively. the vast majority, i would say.

on top of that, some of the best receivers are tackle-breaking receivers because they make one CB look stupid trying to bring them down and have a lot of open space to run.

i totally expect the number and effectiveness of these type of receivers to go up, and based on how people keep talking about building their corners in this forum and others -- there seem to be very few people who are either a) aware of this or b) ready to deal with it with their prospective builds. instead, most CB builders seem to be looking toward middling strength/tackling and slightly increased speed.

should be interesting to see, and that's my rationale behind thinking MT% is going to be hugely valuable, and why Rage's argument that CBs don't need tackling is going to be problematic moving forward :\

a few seasons back i had a CB in SEAPL and he was a run stopping tackling machine. I think most corners neglect there duties in the running game also. if there is a outside sweep you need to have the vision and abilities to shed your block and stop the ball carrier while still being able to cover the WR. this is what most corner builders dont get.

Originally posted by mhayes
a few seasons back i had a CB in SEAPL and he was a run stopping tackling machine. I think most corners neglect there duties in the running game also. if there is a outside sweep you need to have the vision and abilities to shed your block and stop the ball carrier while still being able to cover the WR. this is what most corner builders dont get.

well most CB do have the ability to shed the block... their agility and vision are often much higher than a WRs. strength is also usually higher (usually... obviously it wont be higher if you are against a power WR or the occasional gadget blocking WR). the main issue is tackling once youve shed the block... which in my experience can often be an issue. heck, im thinking about taking sure tackler as my 5th VA for my CBs. pretty soon here there are going to be 100 strength, 140+ speed guys trying to turn that corner, and i dont think 24 tackling will be able to cut it.. heck just 48 tackling probably wont be enough. i think sometimes we get so carried away in thinking about how awesome the new archetypes are going to make our builds that we forget that the builds on the other side are going to be just as good... and so something that used to only pose a minor threat could suddenly become huge. thats how metagames work and evolve.

Originally posted by Worker 3
Originally posted by mhayes

a few seasons back i had a CB in SEAPL and he was a run stopping tackling machine. I think most corners neglect there duties in the running game also. if there is a outside sweep you need to have the vision and abilities to shed your block and stop the ball carrier while still being able to cover the WR. this is what most corner builders dont get.

well most CB do have the ability to shed the block... their agility and vision are often much higher than a WRs. strength is also usually higher (usually... obviously it wont be higher if you are against a power WR or the occasional gadget blocking WR). the main issue is tackling once youve shed the block... which in my experience can often be an issue. heck, im thinking about taking sure tackler as my 5th VA for my CBs. pretty soon here there are going to be 100 strength, 140+ speed guys trying to turn that corner, and i dont think 24 tackling will be able to cut it.. heck just 48 tackling probably wont be enough. i think sometimes we get so carried away in thinking about how awesome the new archetypes are going to make our builds that we forget that the builds on the other side are going to be just as good... and so something that used to only pose a minor threat could suddenly become huge. thats how metagames work and evolve.

yea but what im talking about with my corner. He would shed is block and be in the backfield before the play fully developed.he would also shed his block and run across the field to make a tackle.

Originally posted by mhayes
yea but what im talking about with my corner. He would shed is block and be in the backfield before the play fully developed.he would also shed his block and run across the field to make a tackle.

a lot of CBs do that. your CB isnt special in that regard. like rage's CB that he brought up as bing a good run defender. while i question how many HBs he took down on pitches and such, i have no doubt that his CB broke the block on the WR with relative ease. why? CBs usually have 90+ agility.... WRs generally have 75+. CBs have 50+ strength... WRs have strength in the 30's. WRs also usually have little blocking, and CBs have a lot of vision. in short, CBs have a high break block roll as compared to WRs block roll, and even often have the vision to just run around the block.