What is your opinion of this ability? Is it worth to get 50 points in strength to pick this up as a CB?
(Let's just say Long Reach is taken care of)
(Let's just say Long Reach is taken care of)
Drs
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I want to get it, but I already spent points on quick and track star. I'll probably get it on my 2nd CB seeing as we are going to need more strength in the future.
Steeler2206
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I'm quite pleased i made my CB abnormally strong [compared to most others ive seen anyway] because that VA sounds like fun
Negronic
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this is another mysterious VA. it increases the chance of knocking a pass loose for a dropped pass....
what is the chance of doing this in the first place? does it scale with STR? does that mean you need far greater than 50 STR for the base to anything worth adding to? how frequently do you notice this happening in the first place?
to me this sounds like something that isn't going to be worthwhile now, but eventually it might be.
what is the chance of doing this in the first place? does it scale with STR? does that mean you need far greater than 50 STR for the base to anything worth adding to? how frequently do you notice this happening in the first place?
to me this sounds like something that isn't going to be worthwhile now, but eventually it might be.
Negronic
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to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
Tothehouse
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Originally posted by Negronic
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
Negronic
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Originally posted by Tothehouse
Originally posted by Negronic
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
it depends on how the rolls work. "jackhammer" implies that it is a hard hit that jars the ball loose. think anquan boldin's head injury this year. now think about the scenario you are describing. do you think that a CB would first be able to attempt a PD and THEN still be able to lay out a monstrous hit? i dont think so. I think you should be able to attempt one or the other. either line the guy up and get tunnel vision for the jackhammer, or look up for the ball and try to pick/PD.
now, this is all assuming that bort codes the game to mimic how things work in real life.....
Originally posted by Negronic
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
it depends on how the rolls work. "jackhammer" implies that it is a hard hit that jars the ball loose. think anquan boldin's head injury this year. now think about the scenario you are describing. do you think that a CB would first be able to attempt a PD and THEN still be able to lay out a monstrous hit? i dont think so. I think you should be able to attempt one or the other. either line the guy up and get tunnel vision for the jackhammer, or look up for the ball and try to pick/PD.
now, this is all assuming that bort codes the game to mimic how things work in real life.....
Negronic
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i haven't watched a lot of tape, but i reviewed my team's last game and I cannot find a single instance where it looks like a ball got knocked loose for a drop. not one. I saw about 15 PDs. with borts enhancements to the SIM it is easier to see where the ball is thrown. all of the drops i see look like the receiver just failed the jump check on high passes.
bigpimpin123
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Originally posted by Negronic
Originally posted by Tothehouse
Originally posted by Negronic
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
it depends on how the rolls work. "jackhammer" implies that it is a hard hit that jars the ball loose. think anquan boldin's head injury this year. now think about the scenario you are describing. do you think that a CB would first be able to attempt a PD and THEN still be able to lay out a monstrous hit? i dont think so. I think you should be able to attempt one or the other. either line the guy up and get tunnel vision for the jackhammer, or look up for the ball and try to pick/PD.
now, this is all assuming that bort codes the game to mimic how things work in real life.....
Well with both of them maxed out you have at least a 45% chance for each of them to happen, so it's like flipping a coin twice, and you only need heads once. Those are good chances right there.
Originally posted by Tothehouse
Originally posted by Negronic
to me, this is something that should never be worthwhile for a good corner. think about it. the only time you are going to try to plaster a WR is if you KNOW you have no chance to get a pick or PD and you line up the WR. if a CB is doing this then he is failing at his first job which is trying to PD or pick the ball.
I strongly disagree.
How many times do you get the pass deflection, yet the WR still catches the ball, or you give up the occasional pass because you fail your pass deflection check.
I feel like loading up on Long Reach AND Jackhammer would make a great shutdown corner. Having a chance possibly 3 times to stop a pass from completing seems pretty good to me.
it depends on how the rolls work. "jackhammer" implies that it is a hard hit that jars the ball loose. think anquan boldin's head injury this year. now think about the scenario you are describing. do you think that a CB would first be able to attempt a PD and THEN still be able to lay out a monstrous hit? i dont think so. I think you should be able to attempt one or the other. either line the guy up and get tunnel vision for the jackhammer, or look up for the ball and try to pick/PD.
now, this is all assuming that bort codes the game to mimic how things work in real life.....
Well with both of them maxed out you have at least a 45% chance for each of them to happen, so it's like flipping a coin twice, and you only need heads once. Those are good chances right there.
Negronic
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right, but if your chance to knock a ball loose is low (like if it is similar to observations of FF %.... around 5% from what people have posted in other forums) then it is a waste of VPs that could be spent in more useful VAs.
my speculation is that the likelyhood of a jackhammer hit working is tied to your str and jackhammer skill and the receiver's catching and carrying abilities. in order for the jackhammer to be more effective against that you are going to need increasing amounts of str to counter the receivers increasing catching/carrying.... possibly to the point of gimping your CB.
show me some instances of defensive backs jarring balls loose for drops on a regular basis and I will consider JH a valuable SA. until then count me a skeptic.
my speculation is that the likelyhood of a jackhammer hit working is tied to your str and jackhammer skill and the receiver's catching and carrying abilities. in order for the jackhammer to be more effective against that you are going to need increasing amounts of str to counter the receivers increasing catching/carrying.... possibly to the point of gimping your CB.
show me some instances of defensive backs jarring balls loose for drops on a regular basis and I will consider JH a valuable SA. until then count me a skeptic.
Negronic
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btw on the re-roll SAs, a 45% chance of a re-roll translates into a best-case probability increase of 11.25%. that means if you have Long Reach maxed, your chances of PDing a ball will be, at most, 11.25% higher than if you have 0 points in Long Reach.
the further away from 50% you get (higher or lower) the less LR helps you. for example, a 50% chance would become a 61.25% chance.
The same numbers hold for Jack Hammer.
the further away from 50% you get (higher or lower) the less LR helps you. for example, a 50% chance would become a 61.25% chance.
The same numbers hold for Jack Hammer.
Last edited Jan 4, 2009 22:46:56
Tothehouse
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It seems like this game is all about stacking percentages. 11.25% is a pretty solid number.
Negronic
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Originally posted by Tothehouse
It seems like this game is all about stacking percentages. 11.25% is a pretty solid number.
the bonus on re-rolls peaks at 11.25% if you have a 50% chance. it is MUCH lower if you have a low % chance to begin with.
It seems like this game is all about stacking percentages. 11.25% is a pretty solid number.
the bonus on re-rolls peaks at 11.25% if you have a 50% chance. it is MUCH lower if you have a low % chance to begin with.
awalker
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Originally posted by Negronic
Originally posted by Tothehouse
It seems like this game is all about stacking percentages. 11.25% is a pretty solid number.
the bonus on re-rolls peaks at 11.25% if you have a 50% chance. it is MUCH lower if you have a low % chance to begin with.
Just curious, but how did you come up with that number?
Originally posted by Tothehouse
It seems like this game is all about stacking percentages. 11.25% is a pretty solid number.
the bonus on re-rolls peaks at 11.25% if you have a 50% chance. it is MUCH lower if you have a low % chance to begin with.
Just curious, but how did you come up with that number?
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